Complaint Review: Cuyahoga Falls General Hospital

well it's quite obvious that all of you osteopath defenders who magically keep appearing here are actually employees of the hospital in question.

there is really no need to cite any statistics to prove the lesser qualifications of DO's. it's common knowledge that DO's are a low budget substitute when MD's aren't available or can't be afforded.

look at the staff directory of any of the best hospitals-- the mayo clinic, johns hopkins, the cleveland clinic. how many osteopaths will you find on staff?? virtually none!

BOTTOM LINE: when you need a triple heart bypass, brain surgery, or a disc removed from your back, just try and find a qualified osteopath to do the job. they do not exist.

this thread is done. anyone who doesn't get it by now surely has some vested interest in the above hospital.

Oh yes someone who goes by the name "F**k" must have a great deal of credibility. First off, the billing code only suggests what the patient or insurance company pays the hospital--- NOT what the hospital pays the physician you genius! On average, DO's are payed between $25- 80K per year less than MD's, depending the area of specialization.

Secondly, the average MCAT score for osteopathic medical students is 3.3 points lower, on a 1 to 15 scoring scale. Oh yeah, I'm sure they all just prefer osteopathy and it has nothing to do with their very inferior admission qualifications.

Think before you type next time F**k. Or maybe get a life rather than trolling around here spouting off uninformed opinions.

Oh yes someone who goes by the name "F**k" must have a great deal of credibility. First off, the billing code only suggests what the patient or insurance company pays the hospital--- NOT what the hospital pays the physician you genius! On average, DO's are payed between $25- 80K per year less than MD's, depending the area of specialization.

Secondly, the average MCAT score for osteopathic medical students is 3.3 points lower, on a 1 to 15 scoring scale. Oh yeah, I'm sure they all just prefer osteopathy and it has nothing to do with their very inferior admission qualifications.

Think before you type next time F**k. Or maybe get a life rather than trolling around here spouting off uninformed opinions.

Oh yes someone who goes by the name "F**k" must have a great deal of credibility. First off, the billing code only suggests what the patient or insurance company pays the hospital--- NOT what the hospital pays the physician you genius! On average, DO's are payed between $25- 80K per year less than MD's, depending the area of specialization.

Secondly, the average MCAT score for osteopathic medical students is 3.3 points lower, on a 1 to 15 scoring scale. Oh yeah, I'm sure they all just prefer osteopathy and it has nothing to do with their very inferior admission qualifications.

Think before you type next time F**k. Or maybe get a life rather than trolling around here spouting off uninformed opinions.

Oh yes someone who goes by the name "F**k" must have a great deal of credibility. First off, the billing code only suggests what the patient or insurance company pays the hospital--- NOT what the hospital pays the physician you imbecile!! On average, DO's are payed between $25- 80K per year less than MD's, depending the area of specialization.

Secondly, the average MCAT score for osteopathic medical students is 3.3 points lower, on a 1 to 15 scoring scale. Oh yeah, I'm sure they all just prefer osteopathy and it has nothing to do with their very inferior admission qualifications.

Think before you type next time F**k. Or maybe get a life rather than trolling around here spouting off uninformed opinions.

Lisa above says, "when someone is paid much less for their training and skills..... there is ALWAYS a very good reason for it!!"

Little does Lisa know, DO and MD both share billing codes - for those who aren't so bright like above poster - that means they get paid the same.

In addition, Lisa mentions DOs are rejected by MD schools. Another VERY false statement. I have met SO MANY DOs that did not want to get MD training because they are taught to just prescribe drugs. Whereas they use drugs as an adjunct to using their adjustments, in addition to surgeries that DOs perform. This Lisa is obviously misinformed and has ZERO validity. Maybe she was a DO reject that went to an MD school?

Anyone who knows ANYTHING about medical training knows that people who attend osteopathic medical schools are simply rejects who could not gain admission into ANY conventional (MD) medical school. The standards for admission are much lower at all osteopathic medical schools, and their target marketing is actually geared toward students they know have already been rejected from real medical colleges.
In this free market economy, when someone is paid much less for their training and skills..... there is ALWAYS a very good reason for it!!

Joan obviously has NO CLUE on what an Osteopathic Physician is. They are FULLY Licensed physicians that practice everything from general medicine to neurosurgery (just like MDs). Did you catch "Joan's" claim that osteopathic physicians are limited to practice??? FALSE. I can't believe people would choose their doctor based on initials!! Many MDs go to caribbean schools that let anybody with a heartbeat in their schools. But "Joan" would choose the doctor based on initials, not where they did their residency, referrals etc. Osteopathic physicians get the SAME education as MDs AND MORE It sounds to me like "joan" is an owner of Akron General that she recommends people to go to. I mean, why else would you recommend an entire hospital unless you know the entire staff/physicians? How else would that recommendation be valid? Next time use real marketing strategies.

ND's and DC's are not licensed to perform surgery so, no, I would not allow them to operate on me.

The DO I used to see and I one I see now are not associated with "walk-in" clinics, they are both part of well respected practices with admitting priviledges to some on the areas best hospitals. The first one has priviledges at St. Vincent's Manhattan and St. Luke's-Roosevelt, and my current physician admits to Winthrop University Medical Center. I see these doctors by choice since I have very good insurance.

The stats you quoted are for American medical schools only. Foreign medical schools admit thousands of students with much lower MCATS. They all graduate with MD's but I guess by your standards they are the same as American med school graduates.

And, yes, DO's tend to make less on average because they tend to specialize in lower paying fields such as Internal Medicine, Pediatrics, OB/GYN and Family Medicine. That does not mean that there are not DO's who are in the higher paying specialities like Surgery, Anesthesia, etc.

I entered into this thread just to state some facts not argue with you over which is better. You have your opinion and I have mine. Just as I stated over and over, there are good MD's and bad MD's and there are good DO's and bad DO's.

Osteopaths have no problems with surgery, but don't "jump" at it as a first resort as most MDs will. Of course MDs make more. When they refer you almost immediately for surgery, often for a condition treatable without surgery, they receive referral fees from the surgeon. Also many people are not familiar with DOs and won't seek them out, looking for the highly touted MD behind the name.

DOs are, in my opinion, much like the old country doctor who took a whole health approach to medicine, rather than flooding you with a myriad of lab tests and xrays to diagnose your condition and then medicating you to extremes.

The major difference - Osteopaths will also deal with major musculoskeletal disturbances that may be causing your condition as well as using traditional medical diagnostic techniques. There are Osteopathic surgeons and they must be board certified.

In my experience. I had severe back pain and went first to a traditional MD. Was xrayed, ct scanned, mri'd until I glowed. Referred to Orthopedic surgeon - same tests REPEATED although I provided the initial results - more expense. Diagnosis - Herniated disc, requiring immediate surgery and long term recovery.

I sought a second opinion from an Osteopath. She reviewed the previous testing, examined me, and disagreed with the requirement for surgery. No evidence of a herniated disc, manipulated and performed other treatments and now, 5 years later not ONE recurrence of my pain.

Everyone has their own experience. I am sorry you had a bad one with Osteopaths. It does not make them all worthless.

Allopathic (MD) Med Schools 2008

Average Admission Scores
MCAT VR 9.7
PS 9.9
BS 10

Osteopathic (DO) Med Schools 2008

Average Admission Scores
MCAT VR 8.2
PS 9
BS 8.5

And MD's make an avergae of $37,914 MORE than DO's per year. I guess the DO's just charge less, hmm? No, sorry they're worth less on the medical scale, and that's why you always find them in walk-in clinics.

So would you let an N.D. or D.C. do surgery on you if you liked their "personality?" They are licensed by states.

If you really fall for that alleged "whole person approach," then an N.D. is better qualified than a D.O. who really wanted to be an MD.

I could care less who you prefer to see. I'm just concerned that you are misleading other readers.

If you (anyone) have a bad insurance plan that only allows you to see a D.O. as a primary physician, then I guess you have no choice. But when it comes to invasive or surgical procedures, ALWAYS seek out an MD!

Then why was it when I went to the ER with a knee injury that required surgery did the MD in the ER not only roll his eyes at me, but also instruct the nurses to tell me that I was making a big deal out of nothing.

Luckily (since it was an on the job injury) he didn't give me a release to work. I went to an urgent care center and the DO did a full diagnostic of my injury (not just toucing my knee which is what the MD did.) He put me into a brace and requested an MRI.

I ended up having surgery on my knee. If the MD had given me a work release I would have been working on a knee that needed surgery 3 days later.

I am not in love with a DO, married to one, work for one nor am I a DO. I am not basing my opinion on one doctor but many that I've either met or been a patient of.

You don't like them, fine..stick to an MD then. Better hope they were good enough to get into an American Medical school because there are a lot of MD's around that couldn't make it into an American school and end up going to the equivalent of "Maderia Medical College"

If you truly read my posts, starting with the first one, you will see that I pointed out that I'm sure there are bad DO's just as there are bad MD's. In the others, I was posting some basic facts about DO's, readily available on the internet.

I see both MD's and DO's. I choose a doctor for their skill, education, residency, hospital assocation and personality. I do not choose them on the basis of the initials after their name. If you want to be so narrow minded, be my guest, but you may miss out on a truly great doctor.

Jennifer, Your pro-osteopath bias couldn't be more laughable. You seem to be basing your impression of all osteopaths upon one doctor. Maybe you are that doctor's assistant, maybe you are in love with him,(happens all the time) maybe you are a D.O. yourself. But there is no logic that could possibly defend your position!

So what if they have to take the MCATs????? I went to a very prestigious private college and the same idiots who went to the local community college had to take the same ACT that I did!!!!
I have been in the medical field most of my life and I have to agree with the original poster that D.O.s are widely viewed as students who simply could not get into a better medical school. And I most certainly would never even consider a D.O. over an M.D. when it comes to surgery!

Colleges of Osteopathic Medicine and traditional medical schools are both fully licensed and accredited by the US Department of Education and therefore are required to teach the same curriculum. No matter which one you are applying to, you must take the MCATS. Osteopathic schools go one step further and you must pass an interview designed to test your interpersonal skills. The only difference is that they teach a different approach to medicine.

Osteopaths teach a "whole person" approach to medicine. They also learn to talk to and listen to their patients. In addition, prior to doing a residency in their chosen field, the are required to complete a rotating year in which they do rotations in Internal Medicine, OB/GYN, Peds and Family Medicine. MD's and DO's are required to take state licensing exams although some states do a separate exam for each and some require they take the same exam. (NYS requires they take the same exam)

I used to feel the same way you did until I worked in the hospital system for 6 years and got to know the docs, both MD's and DO's. I found the DO's to be every bit as knowledgeable and much more personable.

Jennifer,

I'm sure there are a number of decent D.O.s-- particularly general prectioners-- and I'm glad you are content with yours. They are not, however, every bit as well trained as MDs. If that were the case, the state would simply issue them an MD license instead.

Originally, osteopaths did not believe in surgery and osteopathic medical schools reflected that philosophy. That ideology has now shifted and osteopathic medical schools are commonly viewed as a second option for students who were not accepted into MD med schools.
D.O.'s are also limited in their fields of specialization-- mainly surgical-- as most states have more stringent standards for D.O.s.

I would have no problem seeing a D.O. for family or internal medicine, ob/gyn, etc. But when it comes to surgery, I will always prefer an MD.
Just my opinion based on my own experiences.

I'm not responding to the substandard treatment you obviously received but just making a comment. Osteopaths (DO's) are real doctors. They are licensed by the state and can do everything an MD does. Two of my favorite doctors are DO's and I receive excellent care from them. I'm sure there are bad DO's just like there are bad MD's. If you feel that the care provided by a DO was deficient, by all means, report them to your state's licensing bureau.