Empire Marketing Systems EMS ripoff sales rep promised training, product, and storefront. Only got medicore coaching, no product, and weak store front. Santa Clara Utah
EMS contacted me and offered to sell me a store front, an information based product on "how to make money off the internet", coaching, and targeted traffic to assist with the business getting off its feet. They agreed to provide support until my investment was returned to me. I was told I would receive an information package in the mail containing information plus how to transfer my site to a different hosting company. I had mentioned using a different hosting company because I had a hosting account setup already. They said this was fine and the instructions to do this would be in the information I would recieve.
I agreed to this and paid them via a balance transfer from my credit card. Being one of the ignorant masses, using a balance transfer did not set off a warning flag and I thought everything was ok.
They emailed a contract and I signed and faxed it to them. Yes, I will admit I was stupid to have signed the contract because half of what was mentioned in the phone call was not in the contract. The contract stated I would have 3 days to ask for a refund after recieving the "product". I am too trusting at times it would seem.
After returning the contract to them I was later contacted to schedule my first coaching session. Upon receiving my first coaching I was very confused. Instead of talking about how to market the information based product I was told would be included with this purchase, the coach was talking about finding a drop shipper to provide any type of product I would want to sell. I will also note that the coach did not give me any advice on how to find a legitimate dropshipper. I was on my own for that part.
After the first coaching session I received my "information package" in the mail. It was 2 certificates that basically said "Hi glad you're here" and had no value at all. So, foolishly, I waited for my next coaching session to see if further instruction would shed light on my situation. We went over how to manipulate the store front, which is a watered down Frontpage copy cat with very few features, and I asked about some questions about the dropshipper. He said one was provided and gave me an address. This address lead me to a store where I could purchase slightly reduced priced items. Nothing on the store mentions setting up a dropshipper account. I assume they want me to buy these products and try to resell them from my house. Not quite how a dropshipper works though.
At this point I started seeking answers. I called EMS 3 times to try and find out why I was told one thing and was now receiving something completly different and mediocre. On each call I was told they would call me back. Big surprise, they never called me back.
I also sent an email asking about the dropshipper provided, the information based product I was told I would receive, and how the targeted traffic worked if I was supposed to find any product and sell it. After a week of waiting they did respond to my email. The only question they answered was about the dropshipper. They said it was a store and I needed to purchase through it and resell the items.
I decided I would try to regain my money back by disputing the charge. I got the dispute started and have received the answer today. They will not dispute the charge because it was a balance transfer made by me.
So, no true customer support, weak web store front,weak coaching sessions, and no product to sell even though I was told they would provide one to me.
Why am I writing this? I wish to warn others of EMS. They will call you and tell you things like "we will guide you step by step", and "we have a proven formula that works". In reality you will only get a few of these coaching sessions and they will be very short. At the time of this writing I have only received 2 of my sessions and have yet to take the others. I will attempt to regain my money before taking them.
If you decide to try EMS, ask for the contract FIRST before sending them any money. If they will not let you look over the contract before paying, then please just hang up and forgot about them. If you do pay them, don't use a balance transfer. But I know from experience that you will not get your moneys worth from this company. If you wish for a true store front go with Yahoo merchant solutions.
Thank you for reading and good luck.
Nicholas
Valdosta, Georgia
U.S.A.
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4 Updates & Rebuttals
Nicholas
Valdosta,Georgia,
U.S.A.
Dispute resolved
#5Author of original report
Tue, April 13, 2004
Well, me and EMS have gotten everything straightned out. It has ended in a manner that I am satisfied and happy with. As of now, the matter is resolved. Thanks for all who have read my report.
Nicholas
Valdosta,Georgia,
U.S.A.
Attempting to get refund
#5Author of original report
Wed, March 31, 2004
I'm just updating this report to say that I have sent a certified mail to EMS asking for my money back. I will post their response when I recieve it.
Nicholas
Valdosta,Georgia,
U.S.A.
have paid $1900.00 for a weak store front that was very limiting and included no help
#5Author of original report
Thu, March 18, 2004
I shall start this first with an update on my current situation. I contacted the Coaching Office(the office that supplies the coaching sessions for EMS) because they respond to my email and don't tell me "We'll call you back" like the EMS customer support line does. After asking them about my targeted traffic I found out that this was another thing that I really didn't get. There is no targeted traffic. The coach who answered my email was kind enough to tell me that he had some promtion software that would help with exposure. While this was a kind gesture on his part, it was also a gesture that should not have had to been made. The traffic was part of the agreement between me and the sales rep over the phone.
As it stands, I have paid $1900.00 for a weak store front that was very limiting and included no help of its own(and I still had to pay $40 a month for it), and 4 coaching sessions, 2 of wich have not provided any usefull information. I still have not taken my last 2.
Now, to address issues raised by Jason, the owner of the company.
Jason said, "We cover everything in the registration as to alleviate any question or to stamp out any errors". I agree with this statement 100%. When I was done with the sales rep I had NO questions. I understood EVERYTHING we talked about and agreed upon. My complaint is not that I did not understand the sales rep, or that the sales rep did not answer my questions. I shall resum my complaint in order to clear any confusion as to what my problem is, here we go:
My complaint is that I have yet to recieve EVERYTHING that was agreed upon between me and the sales rep at the time of purchase. The information based product and the targeted traffic are the main things that I have not recieved, and from what I have now found out they never existed.
"A contract is set in place for your protection as well as to outline what the company will be doing for you as the consumer"
The contract protects the company far more than it does me, though if you look at it a certain way it can be said it gives me some form of protection. I just don't know what that protection is.
"Any extra information is given to clients during registration, 1 800 numbers and contact information"
This is true, I never had a problem with contacting EMS. It was getting them to make true on their promise to call me back that I had a problem with.
"All problems stated in this report were dealt with and handled to the best of our abilities. Trouble with coaching and miscommunication with particular coaches are handled in the most timely manner possible, if coaching is not acceptable we make it so."
If the problem had any form of handling by EMS then the results were never directed back to me. As far as miscommunication with the coach, there wasn't any. I never said me and the coach had miscommunication, we communicated just fine. The coach does not know what was discussed between me and the sales rep.
"Problems with drop shipping and products are dealt with and in this particular case the client knows he was given more options and as much help as possible."
The problem I had with drop shipping is that it was not what was discussed between me and the sales rep. I was told I would be selling an information based product, provided by EMS about how to make money off the internet. If you go to Empire Marketing Systems' website and read their FAQ you will see that it too talks about selling an information based product over the internet, not dropshipping. In fact, parts of this FAQ were used by the sales rep when he talked to me. The link to the FAQ I am talking about is here: http://www.empiremarketingonline.com/faq.htm
As far as these options that I was supposedly told, I have no idea what they were nor when they were told to me. Perhaps if Jason does another update to this he can mention what they were.
"Balance Transfers are not in our best interest but protect the client, and help expedite all transactions"
Not sure how a balance transfer is for my protection. When I tried to dispute the charge through my Credit Card company, they saw that it was a balance transfer and would not take the matter further. As far as speeding up transactions, a normal credit charge would have been just as fast.
Now that that is all addressed I will once again issue my warning that anyone recieving a call from this company should just hang up and save them the trouble.
Jason
St George,Utah,
U.S.A.
We cover everything in the registration as to alleviate any question
#5REBUTTAL Owner of company
Mon, March 15, 2004
To start off the business is on a step by step process. We cover everything in the registration as to alleviate any question or to stamp out any errors.
A contract is set in place for your protection as well as to outline what the company will be doing for you as the consumer.
Any extra information is given to clients during registration, 1 800 numbers and contact information.
All problems stated in this report were dealt with and handled to the best of our abilities. Trouble with coaching and miscommunication with particular coaches are handled in the most timely manner possible, if coaching is not acceptable we make it so.
Problems with drop shipping and products are dealt with and in this particular case the client knows he was given more options and as much help as possible. We will still help him be successful and intend to keep to that promise. We want all of our clients to be successful and give us good success stories.
The contract we send out is for the cleints protection and we would be happy to show it first hand to any clients who ask it of us.
Balance Transfers are not in our best interest but protect the client, and help expedite all transactions. Getting our clients up and running smoothly with no errors and as much guidance as they need is a number one goal.