Complaint Review: Express Automotive

The wire does not end at the connector. As I stated, it goes all the way through the harness, to the PCM.

The OP never said where the short was because he/she does not know.

As I stated, no mechanic would charge $650 to splice a wire that is plainly visible. If the wire WAS plainly visible, the OP wouldnhave pointed it out to the mechanic, or fixed it him/herself.

Go away.

You say it obviously wasn't just a shorted wire?

Please see the original post....it WAS just a shorted wire.

The end.

The O2 sensor wires don't end at the connector. The signals go all the way to the ECM. The short could be anywhere, including tucked away in the harness, or at the ECM pin itself. You have no clue about what is involved. It obviously wasn't the wire(s) from the connector to the sensor itself though. Nobody would have spent that much time on that. The mechanic would have simply replaced the sensor and been done with it.

The mere fact you don't know the difference between a Heritage(brick), MODIS, Genisys, SOLUS, and the $50 nothing you can buy at AutoZone speaks volumes about your lack of skills as a mechanic. I'm guessing you think the Taiwan made tools are the same as my Snap-On collection.

Please stick to singing bad songs in the lounges.

That there is really no good reason for even trying to pay a shop for this kind of problem.

Any monkey with a multimeter and a few basic hand tools (including myself) could have fixed this problem. I would never try to do a transmission rebuild or engine swap in my driveway but this kind of repair doesn't require an ASE certified master technician.

You guys are apparently professional mechanics and that means you know EVEN BETTER THAN I DO that an oxygen sensor wire does not do all the crazy things you imply that it *might* do.

The exact location of the sensor may vary by a few feet and the same goes for the other end of the wire but it's not going to zig zag all around kingdom-come in all kinds of inaccessible places. Worst case scenario: the tech has to remove a heat shield or two, feed the new wire through the firewall, re-ziptie a couple wire bundles and stick the new wire into an existing wiring harness at the computer. 2 hours of labor for a good tech.

As for the computer not being informative enough: My car happens to have 4 oxygen sensors and if one had a problem my borrowed $100 code reader will tell me exactly which one has the problem. I don't know what kind of diagnostic contraption costs thousands of dollars but in my little amateur world there is little that can't be done with a multimeter, code reader, and google. In very rare cases, maybe an o-scope.

But aside from all that there are a lot of people that either don't have the time or inclination to do their own car repairs. Price gouging on minor repairs is no way to get repeat business. You go ahead and charge this guy 600 bucks to replace a length of wire and I promise he'll find a new mechanic when his transmission goes out next year.

I have no idea where the short was. Do you? Nope. The OP has not told anyone what the year, make, model, engine, transmission(you know...pertinent information) the vehicle involved is. This wire may be easily seen, but it may also be hidden. Many cars have the O2 wires routed behind heat shields, and even routed through the floorboard into the passenger compartment. If this is the case, the seat, carpeting, and sound padding must be removed to gain access to the wires.

You think this should all be done for FREE? There is a reason shops charge straight time for electrical issues. They take time.

As for the total bill, I don't see a real issue there. The OP is not complaining about the quality of the work, just the price. That eliminates the actual complaint in my(and nearly all mechanics) mind. The initial diagnostic charge will be on the bill, as will the time required to track down the short(s). Then the time required to PROPERLY correct the problem(twisting the bare ends and wrapping in tape is NOT a repair) is charged. Then finally, the entire system has to be rechecked(more time) to be sure there are no more problems. And NONE of this will be done for FREE.

he could have fixed it himself and saved the money correct?
I doubt the OP had a clue what could have been wrong.
You, nor anyone else knows where this mystery wire was located and how accessible it was or wasn't as stated by Robert so no one knows how long it took. The shop could have just told the OP that it just got pulled in just to shut him up and stop the incessant phone calls he may have been making.
No shop is going to take the word of the consumer as to what is wrong since that can certainly lead way down an incorrect road and cost the consumer even more money then they'd really be crying.

So let me get this straight: You think $650 is a reasonable bill for pulling a code and replacing a shorted/open wire when the customer TOLD the shop where the problem was and the customer turned out to be right?

You are a shady-mechanic-sympathizer. You probably are a shady mechanic yourself.

"A Diagnostic machine costs about $100 at any auto parts store."

One that actually works costs over $2500, and requires $1000 worth of updates annually.

"A good shop won't charge you to hook it up for 5 minutes and pull a code."

A REAL shop will charge at least an hours labor for this, since the scanner is not FREE. The code is not the diagnosis. The code simply tells you where to start looking.

"Troubleshooting and replacing a shorted wire probably took a skilled tech an hour or two."

That may be true. It may also have been a more tedious task, depending on where the short was, and how much stuff has to be removed in order to gain access.

"How much was their initial estimate? You shouldn't have to pay any more than their estimate or mine, whichever is more."

Your estimate is meaningless. The only one that matters is the one from the repair facility. I have never heard of a shop that gives a price for correcting a short circuit without first finding it, and that requires time...something no shop can accurately estimate.

"SUE 'EM"

Of course. Waste more time and money on a frivolous claim.

Good luck.

A Diagnostic machine costs about $100 at any auto parts store. A good shop won't charge you to hook it up for 5 minutes and pull a code.

Troubleshooting and replacing a shorted wire probably took a skilled tech an hour or two.

How much was their initial estimate? You shouldn't have to pay any more than their estimate or mine, whichever is more.

SUE 'EM