Complaint Review: JP Morgan Chase Bank Visa

Hi Jim, I appreciate you taking your time to share comments with me, I can see that you do understand the financial world.  I wish that I also had that knowledge at my finger tips.  You are somewhat incorrect in your thought that the bank/visa decided to push me to a higher interest rate from the 2.99 % because of credit ratings etc.  The entire project was approved and the house was not a concern at that time.

 My accepting the 15.5K on the 2.99 % ( fixed )  was back in "05" my wife died in Dec of 07.  I had been fighting while making payments for a long time. The bank had told me not to set up the auto pay until they said it was time to do it.
Then they went ahead and established a due date with a payment etc.  When I found out about it, I made the payment and said what happened...they the said that I was a day late on making the payment. thats why they increased the percentage rate to over 28 %.  Another part of the story that I did not share, was that the bank "Visa " had contacted me concerning the 15.5 k moneys and wanted to know if I wanted to have death and disability insurance on it.  We talked at length about it and the rep shared with me that by my having placed my wife on the card, if I should accept the
insurance plan then she could be on it as well.  two years later, after having accepted the death / disability insurance program and paying for it as well, my wife became ill and disabled.  It took five seperate filings to get the insurance dept
to finally accept the doctors report of her disability before they would allow that part of the program to become effective. 

When my wife passed away, I contacted them about the cancelling of the balance of the the 15.5K as she was on the insurance program.  Thats when they came back and said "NO", she was not the primary card holder, I was.  Another lie for
cash.  It would appear that when the insurance dept rep's go out to sell their policy's, they can say what ever they want to at the time.  There will be nothing anyone can do several years down the road when death occurs and all they have to do is say " NO"  did not happen, we did not do it, nothing like that was ever promised etc....

I can see the comments of....cannot happen like that.....but it did....As I said before, I did make the mistake of trusting the Bank, so there lies the guilt. but they are the ones that said come back to us and we will fix the problem that they
admitted to at that time.  When I challanged them thru the Fed's, their exec. dept had a someone put together ten years of back data of all transactions for the feds to read over attempting to prove their case.  But they did not make a case, infact the cover letter did a step by step of all events concerning the initial 15.5 K moneys as to when the moneys were issued, paid back and reissued etc.  When you look at the statements you don't see the 2.99 percent anywhere, they left it out totally as if it never happend.

But I still have a letter that says that the 2.99% will be in effect for the duration of the time frame....I appreciate your comments and wanting to analyze this situation, it is just that there is no way for you to know all that is pertant to the facts.  I certainly agree with you that no one can trust the banks, at least not JP Morgan Chase Bank / Visa...

Ron, it is simply impossible to look at the problem you posed without taking all of the other factors into consideration.  The bottom line is that the one item you specifically identified as a 'criminal' act would not have led you to lose the house; I understand you see it that way, but what you see isn't always what you get.

Insofar as what the bank told you, let's remember a couple of other things:

1.  What the bank told you at one time on a preliminary level means nothing.  There was one time where you had good credit and a house worth $325K.  However, two bad things happened to you:

    a.  The housing market essentially reduced your equity down to a much lower amount than the bank was willing to do anything about.

    b.  Your wife's passing changes the game regarding your credit history.  Jointly, you would have had the credit necessary to do what you want.  On your own, you don't have that history and 65% of your FICO score is based on your credit history (alone) and your perceived ability to pay your bills (alone).  If you don't have that history - alone - your score is going to drop.

The bank could have indeed fixed your loan to be 2.99%, but then the question becomes whether the bank thought it was a good idea to give you that loan.  My guess is that the bank looked at your credit score on your own, saw there was no way you could do the 2.99% loan, and steered you into the more expensive loan.  Not cool, but not illegal either.  I mean you needed it for the funeral and I get it.  But the bank was not doing you any favors in giving you that loan.

There are a lot of smart people here Ron.  Many of us have a great deal of financial experience and I suppose even a few of us may have worked at a bank at one point.  I teach this stuff part-time, so I suppose I know more than most.  Documentation you may indeed have, but how that documentation is seen....I suppose that may be in the eye of the beholder.

Banks are not your friend Ron - they never were.  They told you things you wanted to hear and you listened because you needed to hear those things.  You learned late the need to be skeptical whenever you deal with a bank.

Sorry about the title, but lets try and read between the lines and come down to what the main issue is all about.  Fist of all, the bank did say the value was at the 325 k value, that surprised me as well.  However, back to the main issue which is that when I received the "Visa card promotional of 2.99 % (fixed) and that they had 15.5 K moneys available to me because I had such goodcredit.  When I stated AAA credit, that is my own version and yes I did not in fact check that out with the typical credit reporting agency's.  Why should I, if they said I was good for it, thats all that I needed I decide rather than filling out the form and sending it in to the Chase visa dept. (also my falult here, I did not look at two different agencys meaning "BANK " VERSES " VISA"...  So I went directly to the Bank  to insure that there would be no mistakes made.

Thats where I made my biggest error in judgement.  The nice lady bank rep took my information and did the necessary calling etc and filled out the paper work.  Now this is the important section, after she shared with me that all was well, I told her that I wanted to set up a payment for "Auto Pay "  so that the moneys would come out each month making payments so that I would not ever mess up and miss a payment.  The rep told me to hold off and lets not set that up just yet, lets pay off your debtors first, then we will set that up, there is plenty of time and we will be notifying you when to come in to do that.  This is the area that those who chose to rip up my information for some reason bypassed.  You really should read thru that section once again, I made no mistakes other than trusting the JP Morgan Chase Bank/Visa.

If you have gone back to check it out, you will remember that I shared with you that I received no information whatsoever on when the payments were due and certainly nothing about my coming in to set the payments up.  It was by accident that when checking my banking statements on the internet that I found the bank had posted a charge on me the day before making me late for my first payment.  The entire paper trail shows everything that I am saying as being one hundered percent factual and the truth.  After I complained and sent in a letter to them, is when they finally came back and said they were sorry.  ( what happened was ) they could see my account was being paid off by other institutions and asked me to come back to them as they were sorry for their error of increasing my interest rate from the 2.99 percent to over 28 percent.  Then my really big mistake, I did go back to them and used the 15.5K that was now once again available from Chase Visa to payoff the other financial insitutions.  Are you listening at all, this was my major problem, that helped lead me down the rotten path that several of you that made comments about.  Yes I had other debts, that is not the issue, the issue is the mistake made by the JP MORGAN BANK/VISA that lead me down the rotten path that I shared with you.  After making the error in judgement and going  back to them, thats when the hit me from the back side all over again my NOT doing what  they promised doing to make things right.  They had promised to honor the original 2.99 percent interest rate for the 15.5 K moneys but only dropped it down from the 28.8 percent to 18 percent and that to me is a crime that they should be held accountable for.  

THIS IS THE AREA THAT I WOULD APPRECIATE THE READERS COMMENTS ON, PLEASE FORGET GIVING INFO ON LOANS VERSES CREDIT CARD MONEY OR INTEREST ON HOME OR EQUITYS AND POSSIBLE SELLING OF HOME AND ALL THAT GARBAGE, PLEASE JUST STICK TO THIS ONE AREA OF CONCERN. 

I complained to the BBB and the Feds giving them all the info about the situation, and they could do nothing about it.  The bank made a simple mistake, covered it up and then continued covering it up with fancy double talk and no talk at all.  Just how hard is it to read an accounting page when it goes step by step ( as in my case ) where as you can see the  "LOAN "
or what ever you want to call it, then you can see where and how it was paid off in just about one week, then the loan ( or moneys from credit card promo ) was reinstated for 15.5 K  ( did not have to put it against the house ) it was money that I borrowed from the Visa dept to consolidate my bills to help with outstanding medical bills etc.  What the money was used for is not in question, so anyone going there must be from the chase bank dept making up issues to counter what I am
sharing with you.  No need for me to continue haggling with those kind of people if they are not smart enough to listen to what I am sharing with the readers.  Just be smarter than me and don't ever give original papers back to anyone unless its your lawer, then be careful ...one thing I did learn from this experience is that I will never in my life time ever trust this JP Morgan Chase bank with a single nickel of my moneys, its just not worth the risk.  If I get my message across to just one reader, then I would have made myself proud.  Bare in mind, that I had no idea my comments would be viewed for comments by so many....I just had a RIP OF COMMENT TO SHARE...

I do however appreciate those that took the time to read my complaint, a lot of what you said made sence seeing as how I did not take the time to explain in complete detail a lot of particular areas, there is some really smart people out there, I just did not happen to be one of them.  We payed our bills on time, lived completely within our means but sometimes life deals some real curves that just slip across the plate and then strikes you out.  Really did not expect to find crooks in the bank that I had been with for over fifty years.  Yes I know, I was and still am living in a dream world where a simple hand shake is a thing of honor.  Lifes a b***h aint it...Thanks for listening..
..
PS....A thought just whizzed by my feeble mind, I do believe that I accidently passed right over a comment I made up the page a little bit.  Its my belief that Chase bank is using their people to write comments that will make an attempt to make the Ripp Off Comments appear to be of no value.  Don't listen to them, if you have any questions of me and want more proff, I am sure the one that can feed it to you....Thanks again....and thank you Ripp Off website, I appreciate you,,

The OP needs to clarify what was a loan and what was a credit card.



A credit card is not a loan.



A loan is an installment contract for legal purposes and for credit reporting, and is usually secured by collateral.



A credit card usually has revolving terms and is usually unsecured.



In the OP first sentence he calls it a "loan", but then in the sixth sentence he refers to it as "Chase Visa".



The other thing I find confusing is that the OP says he filed BK, but then says he lost his home.

BK would have protected your home.



Too many things just don't add up here.

That Karl is still a boil on the butt of humanity! Jees - please go away!

according to information available on the web.

Anyone can 'Google' this- WHO OWNS THE FED BANK, WHO CONTROLS WHO VIDEO, and watch it on the web, right?

The same charts being displayed at the beginning of that video are also available on the web. Just 'Google' this- WHO OWNS THE FED?, and go to the site with the 5 charts. JP Morgan appears in 'Chart 1', correct?

If you 'Google' this- JP MORGAN CHASE SECRET LIFE INSURANCE POLICIES, you can read the artilcle about the banks that have taken out about $120 Billion in these policies. JP Morgan has $11 Billion in these policies, according to information on the web.

Simply 'Google' this- BANK EXECUTIVES PROFITING ON THE DEATH OF EMPLOYEES, and read that article for proof!

WELCOME TO THE BANKING SYSTEM IN AMERICA- ONE BIG LIE

**********************************   LIE ALERT   **********************************
*Anyone can stay at this site and type in 714450 and go to 'Consumer Comment #4' at Ripoff Report #714450 and sing- "USA IS ONE BIG LIE SONG".

Thank You

That you either made bad choices on your own, or you got some very bad advise.

First of all if a single increase in your interest rate on a 15.5K loan caused you to file Bankruptcy, as much as you may try and convince yourself otherwise you were on your way to Bankruptcy anyways.  You talk about "promotional" rates and VISA.  That makes it appear as if it is a Credit Card(perhaps a HELOC?).  The keyword here is "promotional", those are just that..a promotion.  So after the promotion is over your interest rate is going to increase.  So again..it would have just been a matter of time before you ran into trouble.

The reality of this situation, was that they actually forced me into Bankrupsy.  If they had of allowed me to use my triple AAA credit rating, get the 50K to help me maintain and pay for my wifes burial expenses and to get my head above the water level, I would still have my home and would have been able to have the time to work things out.
- No matter how you try and justify or rationalize it, you CAN NOT borrow your way out of debt. 

If you truly had around 165K in equity in your house there is NO WAY you should have lost your house.  The only way I can see this happening is either your house does not have the value you think, or you just refused to sell the house. 

The next part to this is your credit rating.  It doesn't matter if you have the best credit in the world, if you don't have the income to pay it back no bank is going to lend you the funds.You also claim you needed only 50K.  If we take away the 15K loan that leaves you with about 35K remaining.  If we figure the high end and the burrial costs were 10K that leaves you with just about 25K.  So exactly what did you need that 25K for?  Either you have more debt that you didn't mention, or you were planning on using that 25K to pay back the loan of the 50K you had borrowed.  If it was the former, that would explain a bit better as to your Bankruptcy situation.  If it was the later..again you CAN NOT borrow your way out of debt.  Eventually that scheme would have caught up to you causing you to either borrow more money or just finally declare Bankruptcy. 

Just typing in the word "chase" on this site gives ya a quick 1837 reports filed.  Thats not even trying other variables of the name.  Take THAT with a grain of salt!

If a simple credit card rate change can wipe you out, you were overextended anyway.

The difference in interest cost  on that card may have been about $120 / mo.



And, WHY would you file BK over just 1 credit card?

Simply doesn't make sense.



The common sense solution would have been to just stop paying it for 90 days, and they would have renegotiated then under hardship.

I have done this.

It works.



It appears that you really do not understand credit.



There is no such thing as "AAA" credit.

Credit scoring is done with numerical scores typically ranging from 350 as the lowest to 850 as the highest.



Have you ever pulled your own credit reports and actually checked your own scores??



Also, the closing of a long term seasoned account will seriously impact your credit score. This one act can impact your score from 40 to 100 points, depending on your credit mix.



Then, your score is further impacted by applying for the new card.



If your home really was worth $325k, you should have refinanced that credit card debt into the mortgage while your wife was still alive.



In any case, it was not the simple increase on that credit card that caused your situation.

You had lots of choices.



You could have simply walked away from that debt and they could not have touched you!

SS / Retirement / Disability income cannot be touched under garnishment for civil debt.

Your home cannot be taken for civil debt other than mortgage default.



The bottom line here is that you made very poor choices.

Ron, my condolences for your loss.  Let's look at this because there are some questions that need to be looked at.

1.  At 18.8%, it sounds like the loan you received was unsecured.  The bank should never have issued you a loan at 18.8% unless the loan was secured against the home.  If it were, you could get a much lower interest rate.  At 18.8%, it has all of the feel of a credit card loan.  You may have recourse against the bank for that loan....if it hasn't been discharged already.

2.  I don't know how long ago the home was appraised at, but if I had to guess, the home was no longer worth $325K, no matter what they may have initially told you.  If you had taken the equity loan out on your fixed income, I would have to say the bank was probably right - there would have been no way for you to afford that loan.  The payments, at a minimum, would have exceeded $1300 per month to the bank.  There would have been no way with your FICO score that the bank would have issued that loan.  To add to that, the downturn in the housing market wiped out your equity.  The right move back then (easy for me to say because hindsight is 20-20) would have been to sell the house, pay for the burial expenses, and downsize your life with what was left.  There really would not be ANY way for you to keep the home.  I know that may be harsh, but with one income, it would have been nearly impossible.

3.  My guess (opinion only) is if you filed for bankruptcy, your loan was discharged and the bank didn't recover anything, except for any government loans received related to all defaulted loans.  It would be hard to specifically tie your loan to a credit they received.

You're absolutely right about one thing.  Banks are not your friend...not now...not ever.