Complaint Review: Primerica

The above rebuttal touting Art Williams' success is a perfect example of the "recruit by lies and fallacy" tactc used by the MLM industry generally, and Primerica specifically. What Art Williams has earned is completely irrelevant to the question of how much will YOU make.

When McDonald's hires a new cashier, to they lure him in by showing him how wealthy Roy Kroc was? Does Wal-Mart use the Walton familiy wealth as an inducement for their workers?

Jay Van Andel and d**k DeVos made over 6 billion together, but the average agent of their pyramid scheme (Amway/Quixtar) earns less than $1500 per year.

If anything, success at the top speaks against the opportunities at the bottom. MLMs channel income to the top of the pyramid. If you understand the math behind pyramid schemes, you should recognize that the wore wealth there is at the top, the more poverty there is at the bottom. That's just the nature of the beast.

Here's the cold, hard truth about the Primerica opportunity. According to Citigroup's 2003 SEC filings, the average PFS agent performs less than four FNAs per year. Consider then that the vast majority of agents will not make it past their training period, where they are performing uncommissioned FNAs for friends and relatives. These loved ones are apt to purchase out of pity or misplaced trust.

So here's the business plan: utilize mass recruiting to bring in as many bodies as possible, with complete disregard for whether the recruits are actually capable of performing the work. The majority of recruits will necessarily be incapable of building any kind of meaningful business. These people will inevitably fail out. Before they do, however, we will tap their "warm markets." The recruit will make a few uncommissioned sales to people that are more willing to purchase based on their relationship than the quality of the products. When these recruits leave the company, we bring in more. Keep churning the bottom level and reap the rewards of cost-free turnover.

And THAT'S how Primeria makes money off recruits. In fact, that's how Primerica makes money, period. Free advertising to a self-made market.

I read a few of these reports on Primerica and felt compelled. One of the Primerica employees pointed out the cost of licensing and said that Primerica doesn't make money off of recruiting. However, I am an example of how they do. Yes, I'm embarrassed to admit I got taken for that licensing fee. I was in a transition point in my life, looking to do something different, when I got the Primerica call. I was a bit put off when my "interview" turned out to be a group thing, but I got caught up in the helping people out of their financial binds idea. I knew plenty of people who could be better off financially with just a little help, and I thought this would be a great thing to do (they didn't focus solely on the insurance sales in the talk I went to - that was just ONE of the ways Primerica helped people financially).

I paid my money and started into my training. The first thing they did was get the contact information for nearly every person I knew, even those I knew casually. This made me uncomfortable, because I didn't want to burn bridges with friends, but since I'm not naturally good at networking or sales, I pushed through the discomfort. I was assured this was the best way to get MY business started, by working with people who knew me and who would be more inclined to listen to what I had to say because of that. By my second or third meeting with the person training me, I realized they were rapidly cruising through my contacts, even though I was not yet in a position to be working with them. I started to get concerned that by the time I was trained and ready to perform my first FNA, they would have already hit up every person I knew. Then we got to the point of them running my FNA.

Although I got taken by this scam, I am usually pretty good with finances. When they ran my FNA and I looked at the recommendations (which my "trainer" gave me a hard sell to do), I realized I could get a MUCH, MUCH better deal by calling my local bank and refinancing my mortgage loan with them (which I had been planning to do, but I had waited assuming I would get a much better deal through Primerica). I realized that for some people the FNA recommendations might actually be helpful, but for many they could get a better deal elsewhere. And Primerica, contrary to the talk, wasn't interested in helping people financially, they were just interested in selling their product. My eyes were opened, I started to do some research online and realized that Primerica was, indeed, just a fancy pyramid scheme, and I quit attending training.

So, Primerica pocketed the "licensing" fee I paid, without having to pay any of it to the licensing board. I suspect this happens often. Plus, Primerica got 80 - 100 contact names and numbers of other people to contact, including personal information from me about each one, helping them sort out who they wanted to contact just to run an FNA on and who they wanted to contact about this "opportunity." Seems like a pretty good deal to me - I pay you $200 AND give you 100 other people to market to, with more personal information (I think I had to put whether they owned a house and the number of kids they had and where they worked) than you could easily or cheaply get elsewhere. And all for just a few hours of some "trainers" time. It's a scam, but a pretty effective one.

On his new hit show, the Donald serves as a consultant for failing businesses in need of help.

Donald: Your company is a disaster. I had my staff look it up on the internet. You're plastered all over a fraud site. They come up right underneath your company's web site. How can you expect to do business like that? Caroline, what do you think about these guys?

Caroline: They have failed to address the problems in their company. They look the other way, and pretend nothing is wrong. It's the worst job I ever saw!

Donald: OK. George, what's your take on this whole thing?

George: Well, what I can't understand is how they expect to sell insurance if they can't even afford to pay their own sales staff. The majority of the salesmen earn $5 an hour, for christs sake. Who is going to take insurance advice from a guy earning $5 an hour?

Donald: Interesting.

Donald: John, who should I fire, you or Rick? Which one of you did the worst job?

John points to Rick. Rick points to John.

Donald: You know, in business, you will never be a success unless you can overcome the problems in your company. You two guys have done nothing to solve your problems with your sales staff. You got a public relations nightmare on your hands on the internet. Frankly, you're a disgrace to your parent company. And, I can't see either one of you guys turning the situation around.

Donald: John, you're fired. And, Rick, you're fired too.

Donald does the cobra thing with his hand. Not once, but twice.

Donald: That's it. Up. Out.

George: I think you did the right thing.

Caroline: They were both bad.

You know, I'm so sick of reading these d**n primerica complaints! That's what motivated me to comment.

It's always the same old thing. The complainant comes here to report that a rep for primerica called him up and offered this fantastic job. Next thing they know, they're herded into a room with 100 other job seekers.

It's always the same old scam. Big talk about big money. Little or no real information about what the actual job entails.

Little by little the real story always comes out. When most people find out the truth, they want nothing to do with primerica.

Here's the question for all you primerica shills. Why the hell can't your company clean up its act? Why can't you stop with the spin and just tell people what the company has to offer?

Why is it so hard for you idiots to do that?

Make a job that people actually want to do. And then, explain honestly what it is that you are offering.

Tell people right up front about the pay. Don't lead them on by having them think it's a weekly salary.

Then, maybe you losers won't have to come here every day and try to cover up all this dirt on the company.

Get your act in gear and get the hell off a fraud site! This is common sense.

You know, before I came here, I never even heard about primerica. I probably would have been willing to sit down and listen to what they have to say.

But, now that I read all these complaints, I'd laugh in their face and walk off. You look like idiots. All because of the comments on this fraud site.

The company got here by instigating and continuing deceptive recruiting practices.

Here's a tip. When people feel the need to come here and report you as a fraud, it might just mean that your company has a problem. Don't you think?

So, shills, rather than come here and talk s**t month after month, is there anything you can do to clean up the company's act and put an end to the complaints once and for all?

Your recruiting practices are the problem that landed you here in the first place. You got two choices. Stop running a d**n recruiting scam.

Or else, resign yourself to the fact that you will stay right here on this site until hell freezes over.

And, none of your bullshit spin is going to change that.

You know, I wouldn't have any problem at all straightening this out. Give me 10 days to institute the necessary changes. After that, the complaints would come to an abrupt end.

Now, if I can figure out how to correct the problem, why can't you idiots? This is exactly why the company looks so stupid. Stymied by a simple recruiting problem. Ship of fools!

If you can't correct a simple problem like this and keep your company out of here, what in the hell makes you think you are in a position to help anyone else?

Who in the hell is going to trust a financial company that can't even handle a simple recruiting problem?

Perhaps you should give up on this financial thing, and move on to something easier.

Primericans, I suggest you get your own company in order before you go out and claim to have the answers for the rest of the world!

Art Williams was a high school coach who wanted to make some extra money part-time selling life insurance. He then went into business for himself and his company in the 70's was the foundation of what Primerica is today. His company has been bought and sold and gone through different name changes and business practices.

Citigroup did not start Primerica, they invested in a very profitable company and have reaped the rewards. You asked, "Where's the income from sales of primerica products?" Primerica paid out over $580,000,000 to its sales force last year. They must be selling something, because they do not profit from recruiting.

Again, you ask, "Where's the income from sales of primerica products?" Then you say, "It always intrigues me to see idiots with money." You can't have it both ways. You ask where's the money yet acknowledge it's there.

I've never heard any promises about making $100,000. I'm sure those promises are made, but those who make them are the bad apples that need to be thrown out. The potential is there, as with many other businesses. But you do have to do the work. Your earnings are based on your efforts. This was disclosed to me upfront. We do not hire employees. Each agent is an independent contractor, not an employee. That seems to be a foriegn idea to most people. They look for jobs and earn wages. Wages make you a living, profits make you a fortune. It's up to you to determine how big a slice of the pie that is the marketplace you want. How would we know which people are ambitious and self-motivated enough to succeed in being self-employed or business owners unless we ask? We accept almost all those who are willing to invest their time and efforts in such an opportunity.

From your remarks, I gather that you are not stupid, just ignorant and closed-minded. It sounds like you are from the outside looking in. I'd encourage you to get more information from a Regional Vice President of Primerica in your area. This opportunity is not for everyone. However, the system works for those who work it.

Why did you even bother posting your comments. You call people jerks and idiots. How were you wronged? It doesn't sound like a consumer complaint. That's what this site is for. Did one of Primerica's independent agents take business away from you? Where does all the hatred for this company come from? Can someone please answer that using actual facts. Most people who post here are factually incorrect. They keep using words like "job" and "employee." We do not create those. We simply have an alternative system for those who want more out of life than their current job, experience, or education can give them.

What kind of loser dreamed up this jackass company in the first place?

Let's look at some of the nonsense this company does.

First, they have to waste time recruiting tons of people. What sense does that make? Don't they know what to look for in an employee? What's with this hire-anybody mentality?

Wouldn't it make more sense to hire people who have proven track records of being able to sell financial products?

Forget this upline/pyramid foolishness. Just hire normal people and sell your products. Why all this employee churning?

And, why the need to fool people into taking the job? Calling people at random. Scouring internet job sites looking for anybody who's willing to attend their high-pressure recruitment meeting.

Hire a human resources individual and let them recruit a proven sales staff. Why is that so hard for the idiots at primerica to figure out?

Next, what's up with the commission-only pay? Can't they make a reasonable profit and afford to pay their employees with it? They sure as hell talk crazy big money when they're looking to suck you into their scam.

Nonsense talk about $100,000+ incomes. When, in reality, the average person earns less than $5 for every hour they put into the job. Not even minimum wage! How the hell can they promise you $100,000 and not even deliver minimum wage?

And, the loser reps come here and talk up this great FNA-financial needs analysis. How the hell can a guy who was frying hamburgers last week possible be qualified to analyze someone's financial needs? Wouldn't it make a lot more sense to have a proven salesman who actually can speak intelligently about the products he's trying to sell? I would think so.

I can't see how any of this can lead to any degree of success. Primerica losers sifting through thousands of job seekers each week to find a few hundred willing to attend a recruitment meeting. Once there, the potential employees are promised pie in the sky to get them to sign on.

Naturally, the vast majority fail to sell much. They simply lack the ability to understand the products or the ability to understand the fine art of a sales pitch. It's no wonder. They have no training in any of that.

So, after all these new hires quit, the churning starts all over again.

Hell, it looks like the company spends more time recruiting new people than it spends selling the products. What's the breakdown look like? Eighty percent of your time is spent looking for new members. Twenty percent is spent selling financial products.

Now, I know the idiots are going to come here and point to citi and say look at how successful our parent company is. OK, great. Citi make money in the banking industry. So, how did they go from banking and lending to this foolishness?

Money doesn't always imply intelligent behavior. All you need to do is look at the millions of dollars spent on dot-com foolishness to see that. What was the name of that idiot site? Pets something? Dot com.

Those fools just threw up an internet site. Never mind how they planned to make a profit with it. They never bothered to think that part out. Fifty million dollars later, someone finally figured that there was no profit in pet products sold from the internet.

I see the same thing here. This primerica business model makes no sense. Bad products. Sold by blue color workers. Who were promised big bucks to join up. Except, they have no understanding for the financial products they sell. So, they fail. Only to have the remaining members search even harder for more job seekers willing to give the company a try.

The whole cycle repeats over and over again. Where's the success in that? Where's the income from sales of primerica products?

When you stand back and take a hard look at this company, it looks like one of the dumbest things to come along in a while?

What I'd like to know is who takes credit for creating this nonsense? Where did this primerica concept originate? And, what jackass school turned out the loser who thought this up? What did he major in? Business flops? The fine art of running around in circles? How about mass recruitment for no particular purpose?

Hey, I really don't mind if anyone is dumb enough to join up with primerica.

I'm much more interested in who thought up this silliness. And, how did that person convince Citi to throw good money out the window to start the whole thing up?

It always intrigues me to see idiots with money. It's like water flowing uphill. It defies gravity, as well as logic. In normal life, the idiots sink to the bottom. It's unusual for them to have millions of dollars to waste.

I'd like to understand how somebody with money ends up throwing it away on this primerica craziness. Some idiot at Citi gave the green light for primerica. I'd like to know who that was, and what they were smoking at the time.

If you knew all the people I helped who had whole Life, Universal Life, Variable Universal Life Insurance policies that were just paying way too much money every month and didn't have a clue how much money they were paying every month who also didn't have a clue how to read their policy, or even know were their insurance policy was. I took these people out of worthless insurance policies put them into TERM insurance policies where I was able to more than double their coverage and invest the difference in a NO-Load mutual fund that averaged 15% per year and absolutly change their financial life forever. this is what I learned how to do by paying this great company called Primerica a measly two hundred bucks for the knowledge and education on insurance and securities which the company didn't make a dime on. every time I helped a client who trusted this great company I made about $300.00 per hour, or considerably more.

Primerica does not take advantage of people through the $200 licensing fee. Each representative is an independent contractor. They do not make money or earn commissions by recruiting people. That would violate anti-pyramid laws. They only make money by providing financial services. Representatives do not profit from the $200 licensing fee.

Here, The State of Texas charges a $50 licensing fee for a license to sell insurance. But you can't get the license without taking the test. Texas's testing provider is Promissor. Prommisor charges $82.50 to take the test and get fingerprinted. All that's left from the initial $200 is $67.50.

Well, Primerica also supplies the study materials to pass the test to get the license. Those materials, sold by ABLE Inc., would cost $100 if bought directly from that company.

Do the math. Out of the last $67.50, Primerica supplies $100 worth of study materials AND a two day tutored class to get your insurance license. After supplying the materials and paying the instructor, there is nothing left for the recruiter to profit from. You simply become an independent agent of Primerica.

You then build your own business as you see fit. When you sell financial products, you profit, your upline profits, and your client is better served than before. If you wouldn't like helping people achieve financial independence, Primerica is not for you.

It costs money to get your driver's license or real estate license: from education, to testing, to the state licensing fee. Getting your first license to work with Primerica is no different. That $200 is split among different entities to get you your first of three licenses required by the state to sell all of our financial products that "help families become debt free and financially independent."

Everyone wants to achieve that status. Few are willing to admit they need help getting there. Marketing through referrals gets this message out effectively as YOU bring credibility to your warm market (family, friends, co-workers).

Primerica does not take advantage of people through the $200 licensing fee. Each representative is an independent contractor. They do not make money or earn commissions by recruiting people. That would violate anti-pyramid laws. They only make money by providing financial services. Representatives do not profit from the $200 licensing fee.

Here, The State of Texas charges a $50 licensing fee for a license to sell insurance. But you can't get the license without taking the test. Texas's testing provider is Promissor. Prommisor charges $82.50 to take the test and get fingerprinted. All that's left from the initial $200 is $67.50.

Well, Primerica also supplies the study materials to pass the test to get the license. Those materials, sold by ABLE Inc., would cost $100 if bought directly from that company.

Do the math. Out of the last $67.50, Primerica supplies $100 worth of study materials AND a two day tutored class to get your insurance license. After supplying the materials and paying the instructor, there is nothing left for the recruiter to profit from. You simply become an independent agent of Primerica.

You then build your own business as you see fit. When you sell financial products, you profit, your upline profits, and your client is better served than before. If you wouldn't like helping people achieve financial independence, Primerica is not for you.

It costs money to get your driver's license or real estate license: from education, to testing, to the state licensing fee. Getting your first license to work with Primerica is no different. That $200 is split among different entities to get you your first of three licenses required by the state to sell all of our financial products that "help families become debt free and financially independent."

Everyone wants to achieve that status. Few are willing to admit they need help getting there. Marketing through referrals gets this message out effectively as YOU bring credibility to your warm market (family, friends, co-workers).