Complaint Review: Regions Bank

& you're right.  It's not unlawful to park an unlocked car but there are several reasons why my analogy doesn't quite cover all the bases.  What I do know is that two people who broke into MY car both got six months of prison and a year of probation for stealing less than the value of an over-draft fee.  Banks, who have made a metric ton of money off of this practice, seem to be doing quite well in spite of their very clear victimology profile. 

I love how you toss in that word, knowingly, as though this one instance where this person actually did notice he was out of balance and actually tried to correct it, frames a banking practice which is absolutely corrupt as a natural response for the "real" victim in this story.  It's kind of like bumping into someone accidentally and excusing yourself only to have them punch you in the stomach.  It actually reminds me of a sociopathic acquaintance of mine who always used to say, "If someone f*cks me, I'll f*ck them ten times over."


Not a rational response for him and not rationally defensible for the banks.

You provided a poor analogy because it is not unlawful for a person to park their unlocked car in a bad neighborhood but it is unlawful to intentionally overdraft a bank account.

You are all wrong.



What's happened here is no different than if someone had left their car
doors unlocked in a bad neighborhood.  Even when the car had been
repeatedly broken into, and the person failed to heed advice from
friends and warnings from the police, it is still the fault of the
thieves for breaking into the car and stealing valuables from within. 
How anxious you've all been to reduce this to its mathematical dilemmas,
that a stoic register, free from transposition errors and other simple
mistakes somehow mitigates the lack of moral compass demonstrated by the
banking industry.



That is wrong, and what's worse is that it is insane.

The bottom line here is that money in your account has to be posted and available for use PRIOR to initiating ANY transaction against said money.

The days of "floating" transactions are LONG GONE!

Keep an accurate register.Stop spending when you hit $0.

It really is just common sense.

So why is this such a difficult concept for so many people to grasp?? Are we really surrounded by such a high number of mental midgets?

Very scary.

"because someone had a moment of absentmindedness"

No Eddie it isn't about a moment of absentmindedness. The OP wrote "for months I have had paid hundreds in overdraft charges" is an admission of repeat overdrafts.

"is entirely within the bank's technological ability to decline transactions on debit cards that would put the account out of balance"

We have previously discussed the opt-in and opt-out custom overdraft options but you continue to turn a blind-eye to that subject.

But Eddie, it's not a "single mistake" as you say. The OP admits to paying hundreds of dollars in OD fees. This proves that the OP is not managing their finances in a intelligent way. Remember, insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result. If you spend money from your account before it's available then you're going to get a fee every time. Some banks have the $5.00 limit, where if the overdraft is less than $5.00 they don't charge a fee. But if the OD is $5.00 or more, here's the fee. So with these banks or the other banks, whether the OD is $0.01, $0.60, $1.21 or any amount the OD fee will get charged. It's not a rip off it's the OP not keeping an accurate register.

   Can banks make a mistake? Yes, it occasionally happen happens. But the majority of these reports are not about bank errors. They're about errors by the account holder who will blame everyone but themselves.

   Do some responders use language that's a little over the top? Yes they do. But even when someone replies politely with an opinion that the OP or other "victim" disagree with (such as it's not the bank's fault) then there's a lot of inappropriate language on that side as well. Most of the people posting here that have been called "bank defenders" actually aren't. They are giving good advice as to what happened and how to avoid the fees in the future. Then you have some posters that attack every OP and some responders that attack every poster. 

   But bottm line is, almost every repost about OD/NSF fees is not the bank's fault or error, it's the fault/error of the OP. But we've become a society where a lot of people don't want to take responsibilty for their own actions. They can't gat ahead because the big, bad corporations are ripping them off left and right. And the sad thing is, it's just not true.

Could it have something to do with the fact that your "advice" seems to normalize a technically unnecessary banking practice that "lets" an account-holder fall out of balance, the aim of which is being able to assess fees resulting from the out-of-balance condition?  Maybe it has something to do with the tone of the advice...

Take Steve's, for instance:

I noticed in several instances you mentioned a "debt" card. What is that??
Did you mean "debit" card? Somewhere along the line you authorized overdrafts on your account with the debit card.

The recent federal law changes allowed you to opt out. Obviously you
failed to pay attention.Why not just keep an accurate checkbook
register? That is the easiest solution here.

It's called discipline.

If you initiate a transaction when you do not have the funds to cover it, that is strictly your fault.

You will pay overdraft fees when you do this.

In the same business day, checks, debits and charges get posted before deposits and credits.

That is the way it works.

Nothing new.

"No you don't know why..."

Yes we do. You drew against unavailable funds. You know it too.

"60 cent mistake, yes that's right 60 cents, and yes they aren't suppose to not charge a OD unless it's over $5.00"

-60 cents is below zero. That constitutes an overdraft. The waiver for accounts that have an overdraft of under $5.00 is a policy (not a law) offered by some banks. Regions Bank does not offer that feature.

You drew against unavailable funds. Not a rip off.

Must be a lot of account mismanagement!

$300,000 down to 20 bucks??

A $22 deposit??

WHO deposits $22.

Why not $25? or $30, or an even $40??

What a joke.

The bottom line here is you initiated  transaction when you did not have the money in your account to cover it.

No rip off.

- Sorry but I don't see Real Estate Moguls wiping out
their $300K+ bank accounts to invest in property.  To the point where
they have to make $22 deposits and overdrafting their accounts.  So
either your account mis-managment is bigger than you are showing, or you
are lying.

As much as you(or anyone else) doesn't want to admit it.  The only way
you are going to overdraw your account is if you spend more than your
available balance.  Your available balance is determined by the funds
availability guidelines, and the posting order and fees are in the
terms. 

Perhaps you should have used some of that 300K and invested in a little more education.

There are classes in money management offered to the schools through Junior Achievement (among other organizations).  There are many of our bank officers that volunteer to teach the classes and they are very well received by the schools and students alike.

I am happy to report that some K12 schools do provide classes that include the importance of money management and use of a check register.

The small, demographically poor school system that I retired from last year required a class called 'Life Skills' for all the students.  It includes many skills that people need to be aware of on a daily basis in 'the real world'.  Money management is part of that.  I think it's a great idea and so do the kids.

but the lesson has been spelled out here on ROR by Bankguy and many others. The people who overdraft aren't listening because they're positive it's all the bank's fault. Anything said to try to enlighten them as to how the system works to help them avoid any OD/NSF fees is viewed as "bank defending" and the poster is accused of working for the bank.

It's funny, when the laws changed a lot of the posters that supported the new law (Edward from Dallas and others) said that the reports about OD fees would be eliminated. However they're still here because some people won't practice personal responsibilty by keeping an accurate register.

The ability to control your fees rests with the account holder, legally and otherwise.  You also bring up an interesting point in which the bank is not responsible for teaching anyone how to balance a checkbook.  I've always been partial to the idea that banks should offer their account holders a free class on managing their money, once they incur $100 in overdraft fees.  25 people maximum in the class.  The class would be paid for by the bank (free for account holders) and taught by someone not employed by the bank on how to to avoid overdrafting accounts.  Schools certainly don't teach the subject, and parents seem to have forgotten to do so.  If the account holder fails to take advantage....tough on them.

It's sort of like traffic school; when you get a ticket, the theory is that when you go, it should improve your ability to avoid another ticket in the future, which then lowers your auto insurance. 

I read this post, as well as the comments. I wanted to chip in a few helpful hints for people to manage their accounts. First of all, a pending item doesn't get assessed a fee until it hard posts to the account. If a fee hit Friday night, it was because the hold placed on the card caused an item to hard post in the negative Friday night. Regions does not hard post on weekends, all weekend items and associated fees will hit on Monday night at midnight at the earliest.

Everyone needs to keep a register of all their transactions and not depend completely on ATM balances nor ledger balances online or via mobile banking. Gas purchases at the pump initially do not show most times against your balance for several days. It is not the bank's responsibility to teach people how to balance a checkbook, bottom line.

Another interesting note, you have the option of opting out of the standard overdraft coverage. That puts you behind the wheel of the bus rather than under it. Call your bank and make it happen.

Now that you see the banks true colors, would you have really wanted to leave that money with them?

Your mattress is your friend, the bank is not!

It's all so uniform, kind of how you all respond in the same way, ignoring the same facts, with the same denigrating feedback, abusing the same moral high-ground you invoke about personal responsibility with the same unsustainable hypocrisy that fails to stand up on its own when the light is shined on new banking practices.  It's like you all drank from the same Kool-Aid bucket and have taken the same classes in Totalitarian Thought Reform so that you could all behave similarly in order to convey the same over-arching message, conforming to, just as I predicted, a concerted effort to convince someone they're wrong for being indignant about being ripped off.


I definitely see a pattern, here.

"This bank knows I will be closing my accounts, and knows I took my money else where, so why shouldn't they make it as difficult as possible on us before we close our account and make as much money off us."

They didn't change policy because you are moving. The policy of penalizing for overdrafts existed before you informed them you were moving. Your new bank has the same policies.

"for months I have had paid hundreds in overdraft charges and couldn't figure out why"
"unfair treatment of the customer in not allowing them any time to correct a error"

You lied in that quoted statement. It was not a single error. It is your habit of repeat overdrafts.

To the op just ignore steve,   he Is heartless don't give him the time or day or the rest of the people who have sent mean comments. 

I never understand why people try to embelish their status to try and make themselves sound more important than they are.

 have banked at Regions for years and for years they didn't even know I even was a customer until I deposit over 300,000.00 into their bank and from that magic moment they all knew my name and would roll out the so called "red carpet" for me.  They would actually call me if their was a mistake in my account and bring it to my attention and would correct it right away, so I did not accrued any OD charges, they couldn't do enough for me.  I decided to invest my money in real estate and other deals, when my account didn't have that much money in it, I was again lower in their banking categorized as "middle class" and they forgot my name and that I even banked with them, and as for giving me anymore heads up on my account, they were now bouncing items left and right,

- Sorry but I don't see Real Estate Moguls wiping out their $300K+ bank accounts to invest in property.  To the point where they have to make $22 deposits and overdrafting their accounts.  So either your account mis-managment is bigger than you are showing, or you are lying. 

As much as you(or anyone else) doesn't want to admit it.  The only way you are going to overdraw your account is if you spend more than your available balance.  Your available balance is determined by the funds availability guidelines, and the posting order and fees are in the terms. 

Perhaps you should have used some of that 300K and invested in a little more education.
   

Steve, Why $22 and not $30 and so on, First of all I wanted to keep as less as possible in that account because I have checks directly deposit to it, and secondly I haven't changed the direct deposits to another account because I am in the process of moving to another state.  So you see Steve your opinion on it being a JOKE is because you are not aware of the circumstance of my reasoning for having a low amount in that account, now by knowing what the reason is, you now are aware how ignore your comment was and how you don't have the ability to look outside the financial box that is ripping people off.  No matter what my reason are for keeping a low balance in that account, it's still unfair treatment of the customer in not allowing them any time to correct a error without being charge the unreasonable fees.  It's not about the money, it's about the unfair treatment of the middle class people who struggle every day to make it.  This bank knows I will be closing my accounts, and knows I took my money else where, so why shouldn't they make it as difficult as possible on us before we close our account and make as much money off us.  Now lets not forget this bank has about 7 employees so it's a small so called "REGIONS" bank, that just moved into a newly built building that I'm guessing the so called "middle class" people paid for from all the fees they've collected from them, when the other bank building they moved from was a nice bank building, this just shows how the misuse of large company money during a economical hard time does not effect them, and for the little people that are struggling to make it, only shows the BIGGER COMPANIES such as "REGIONS" get richer off the little people, while the poor get poorer.  So Steve, if you don't see something wrong with this picture than you are a "JOKE"...

Using well-healed cliche's based on largely debunked talking points to refute an argument on the internet doesn't make your rebuttal correct, but you keep thinking that way.  I, however, don't have any need to abuse your assumptions, any further.  It will be the cold-hard concrete floor of factual logic, that does that. 

Keep using your confirmation bias to shape your world view.  That responsibility you invoke will find you.  When it is too late, you will realize that relegating your thinking to regurgitated punditry, regardless of your political affiliation, is one the least responsible things you're guilty of.

It's as though you named yourself Truth Detector because you avoid it, like one avoids land-mines.

Must be a lot of account mismanagement!



$300,000 down to 20 bucks??



A $22 deposit??

WHO deposits $22.



Why not $25? or $30, or an even $40??



What a joke.



The bottom line here is you initiated  transaction when you did not have the money in your account to cover it.



No rip off.

Which is the useless outlet?

Now we see where all the shill mentality is coming from?

If you stay away from regions completely, you could be saving THOUSANDS!

"60 cent mistake, yes that's right 60 cents, and yes they aren't suppose to not charge a OD unless it's over $5.00"

-60 cents is below zero. That constitutes an overdraft. The waiver for accounts that have an overdraft of under $5.00 is a policy (not a law) offered by some banks. Regions Bank does not offer that feature.

You drew against unavailable funds. Not a rip off.

In lowering the amount of money the bank would be able to draw on, you effectively traded the leverage you held at the bank for your capital investment liquidity.  With less money in your account, you were effectively relegated to the 10% tier of customers earning banks what's being estimated between 40-90% of their revenues.  At its most simplistic reduction, it's a quid pro quo situation.

You took capital liquidity away from the bank, ergo, they found a way to turn your account with them into a more direct source of revenue.  If you think about it, from a marketing perspective, the bank earns relatively little from an account which is always being depleted because it has no capital in that account with which to draw on.  If you decide to keep your money there, they may as well be earning something for it in the form of bilking you with OD fees, and if you get pissed off and pull your money out of the bank, entirely, they don't lose anything but the chore of having to keep up with your dwindled account.

It may seem callous and it is, but good marketing doesn't want every consumer.  They target only the consumers who make them the most money.  The consumers who cost businesses money are also targeted in ways which ensure their alienation and therefor reluctance to do further business with them.

Let me reiterate, I find the practice of over-drafting objectionable and quite a bit more exploitative than simply declining service to a customer would be.  The latter is what should be practiced, if you really want to believe in an ethical zero-sum game.  The fact that the former is rigorously applied, speaks to the fact that it's an unethical zero-sum game reliant on the willful manipulation of information to mask both its nature and the information allowing Player B to make adequate decisions, favorable to both parties.

Only a lib would try to prove a point regarding the virtue of being irresponsible by linking to a web page published by a know-nothing, useless media outlet like PBS.

Here's a newsflash for you, hero:

Overdraft protection is now an OPT-IN service.

By asking for the service, the OP got it. By failing to manage the account like a responsible adult, the OP asked for the fees.

No rip-off here...just another in a long line of idiots intent on blaming everyone but themselves for their poor decisions in life.

Okay, yes I've got a lot of post and I am the type of person who doesn't back down easily...For all those who are the so called "spelling patrol" oops on debt meaning debit card.

I have banked at Regions for years and for years they didn't even know I even was a customer until I deposit over 300,000.00 into their bank and from that magic moment they all knew my name and would roll out the so called "red carpet" for me.  They would actually call me if their was a mistake in my account and bring it to my attention and would correct it right away, so I did not accrued any OD charges, they couldn't do enough for me.  I decided to invest my money in real estate and other deals, when my account didn't have that much money in it, I was again lower in their banking categorized as "middle class" and they forgot my name and that I even banked with them, and as for giving me anymore heads up on my account, they were now bouncing items left and right, so I guess the old saying stands, "money talks and bullsh*t walks",  So my question is, Is this banking procedures fair to practice to everyone, with or without a lot of money?  So please don't hand me that banking policy crap!  All banks no matter who they are go out of their way for customers with money, so they don't take their money elsewhere, when in actuality it the poor middle class people they should be going out of their way for, because without all our so called miserly amount of money that they use they would not be in business...Policies only work when it's in their favor!!!

"No you don't know why..."

Yes we do. You drew against unavailable funds. You know it too.

I am confused. If you had the $22 to deposit the next day, then why didn't you just pay it at the register? When I was in high school, we were taught to balance checkbooks and use a register. I don't know why they don't teach kids that anymore. I really think kids don't know about registers. Ask your bank for a register and use it. It will save your life.

If you refuse to use one, then your best bet is to opt out of overdraft protection. Go to your bank and ask to opt out of it. That way, if you don't have the funds, your card will be declined at the register, which may be embarrassing, but it will give you the opportunity to put something back, pay cash, or whatever, but the important thing is you will not have overdraft fees.

Also, you may ask your bank to credit the overdraft charge. If you are nice and not confrontational, it is possible that they may do this. Good luck.

Here you are, again, Jim, making it seem as though the bank's role in this is plausibly justifiable.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/creditcards/

This Frontline episode covers a lot of ground regarding credit cards but also speaks to the practice of "courtesy" loans.  Again, if it was in the bank's interest to stop letting debit card transactions create out-of-balance conditions, they would.

I noticed in several instances you mentioned a "debt" card. What is that??
Did you mean "debit" card? Somewhere along the line you authorized overdrafts on your account with the debit card.

The recent federal law changes allowed you to opt out. Obviously you failed to pay attention.Why not just keep an accurate checkbook register? That is the easiest solution here.

It's called discipline.



If you initiate a transaction when you do not have the funds to cover it, that is strictly your fault.

You will pay overdraft fees when you do this.



In the same business day, checks, debits and charges get posted before deposits and credits.

That is the way it works.

Nothing new.



MANAGE YOUR ACCOUNT!!

No it wasn't because funds weren't there it was because of a 60 cent mistake, yes that's right 60 cents, and yes they aren't suppose to not charge a OD unless it's over $5.00, well this bank did, and by the time they got done bouncing other checks it was up to hundreds of dollars.  I am willing to take the blame for a 60 cent mistake, but I refused to take the blame on them taking all the OD charge first then taking the check amount out, that's what caused hundreds of dollars of OD charges, yep you guessed it I am just a little part of a GIANT  big RIP-OFF company...

  These days, you have to be in order to beat the transaction to the bank.   Oh, and by the way, its called a DEBIT card.  

   Seriously, when you went over your balance, you overdrafted.  Doesn't really matter what you did afterward, the overdraft had already occurred.  That happened on Friday night. 

" I have had paid hundreds in overdraft charges and couldn't figure out why,"

  That's not surprising since you posted here thinking you could beat an electronic transaction back to the bank.    Given your history, you should really make an effort to keep an accurate register for the account.   If you never overdraft in the first place, you could be saving hundreds.

Cash or credit is always a better option when you have a sneaky bank and funds are low.

If you have a savings acct at the same bank, and online access, you should've just logged on and transferred some money from savings to checking (if you had funds to cover).

That would have been better than all that driving around and hassle for nothing.

I have this setup on one of the debit cards I use the most.  I keep most funds in savings (where it is "safer") then just allow a little on the checking side for personal use etc.  I usually use credit card, but if for some reason I want to use the debit, I just go ahead and use it, then log on and transfer the funds.  (to be even safer, you can transfer the funds first)

Never been charged an overdraft yet, (maybe I'm just too quick for em) but then again I deal with a "semi-honest" bank.

Haven't had to screw em over yet either.

Another thing to be aware of, is to avoid using debit at the gas pump and use cash or credit instead.  Several people have posted here that gas stations are putting "holds" on the debit card tying it up for some time- making all their other purchases declined.

You have to be a smart consumer once the bank has their claws on YOUR money.

Oh yeah, Regions has 103 reports today also.

You would have been charged an overdraft fee even if BOTH transactions were pending on Saturday.  Once you used your debit card for that transaction, you incurred that fee.  It doesn't matter when the transaction occurred; the concept of commerce doesn't stop simply because the bank happens to close its doors. 

Racing $22 to the bank the following day really changes nothing regarding your liability either.  Since debit transactions occur at the speed of light.... there is no more racing to the bank.

If you wish to avoid this situation in the future, here are some simple things to consider:

1.  Avoid using debit card transactions when your balance in the account drops below $50.  Stick primarily to cash.  It may be inconvenient, but you will stop giving money to the bank.

2.  Try to limit your debit card usage to an ATM.  Use credit cards instead if you get in a bind.

3.  Go to your bank and remove overdraft protection or capability.  You want the bank to deny you the use of your debit card.  That may become embarassing when you slide your card, but you will stop with the overdrafts.

The practices you're experiencing are universal in the industry - this bank is really like any other bank out there because they all have the same practices.  Their practices are legal and you agreed to the policies when you opened the account with them.

That's what the bank does.

Word to the wise:  There are probably about to be a lot of posters here who want to bully you into believing this is all your fault and that you're the one who acted irresponsibly.  As someone who was around before "courtesy loans" were common place, I can assure you that banks have every reason to let you fall out of balance on a debit card transaction.  It is a 38+ billion dollar per year revenue stream for them.  They "risk" losing two dollars for the overdraft you "created" while they gain 33 additional dollars when you put more money in the account to fix the "adjusted" out-of-balance condition.

They could just as easily decline transactions at the merchant level for debit cards.  They just choose not to.  The unfortunate thing is that the industry narrative is prevalently extolled in these here murky internet waters.

It's a narrative which puts 100% of the blame on the consumer for falling out of balance, to begin with, paints the banks as "victims" and completely ignores the technical and statistical truths regarding over-draft fees/courtesy loans.  In short, it's completely willful intellectual dishonesty and no matter how well-worded, my advice is that you don't fall for it. 

Your only mistake was a momentary lapse of judgement and you've owned that.  When the banks have it within their ability to ensure such lapses don't translate into an out-of-balance condition in your account, they choose not to.  Seriously, don't take anyone who tells you otherwise at their word.  At best, they're trolling and at worst, they're banking apologists with something to gain by perpetuating a willfully ignorant narrative.


Don't believe the hype!

"I have had paid hundreds in overdraft charges and couldn't figure out why"

It's because you spent money before you deposited the funds. Don't do that.