Complaint Review: Tempe DodgeChryslerJeep

I have tried to reach David Stanley the service manager involved in this matter, i have left many messages and no call back. I asked him for a refusal letter in the message and asked him to call me back to let me know when i could pick it up? It's going on almost 2weeks and still nothing. I have consulted with an attorney and now i can see that legal action is the only way to get through to this dealer and David Stanley. My truck still continues to sit in driveway broke and lots of stress dealing with this matter. Please anyone before going to Tempe Dodge think twice about it. They are real nice when selling you a truck or car, not so nice when it comes to fixing it, definately don't honor their warranties like they say, instead they play games with you and try to push the problem off on the customer.  Stop selling Lemons....

at least according to Federal Lemon laws and AZ Lemon Laws.  According to the law, the car must be in the shop many times for either a variety of things, or for a single thing.  From your story, your car may qualify BUT you need to get with an attorney specializing in your state Lemon Law.  See if you can find someone who can take the case on contingency.  Otherwise, you may be out more money - BUT the attorney may try to recover his fee from Dodge.

Stop typing and stop trying to do this yourself.  You need a lawyer looking at this...NOW!!

I also drove a car for years with an check engine light on.  Usually not a big deal unless it begins to flash.

@voiceofreason,

It has been a century since domestic vehicles have been made on both sides of the US/Canada border, this is nothing new and shouldn't be confused with outsourcing production to cheaper-labor countries. The reason for this was quite simple, it allowed US car-makers to export "Canadian" vehicles to Europe at a much lower tariff because Canada was part of the British Commonwealth. In those early days vehicles built in Canada were duplicates of those made here but nowadays the Big Three assign specific models to specific plants regardless of location -as long as it's within the US and Canada- and those models are then sold in both countries, they are what we call "domestic" vehicles. There is no duty on Canadian-built cars or trucks (in fact most light trucks/SUV/Minivans are made there) since they are not imports.

To the OP: the engine light in my car has been on for 7 years and I never had any serious problems with it even though at least 5 different mechanics have attempted to find something wrong related to the engine light, but couldn't. It is my understanding that the engine light sometimes comes on for very esoteric issues that will never have any effect on how the car performs. I would likely become concerned if the engine light did NOT come on on my vehicle.    

Tempe Dodge as well as Dodge is screwing its customers by not paying for my truck 2007 6.7L Diesel to be fixed. The engine has 54K miles and a blown Turbo with clogged injectors and just sits in my driveway. The fuel filter was replaced at 41K miles. This means that the current fuel filter is still less than 15K miles. Yet they declined to fix my Turbo and replace any bad injectors because they said that I did not replace the original factory filter at 15K miles and therefore the factory warranty is void. It is interesting that they covered warranty items at 41K, which included a bad ERG valve. At that time I had oil, air filter, fuel filter, and rear Diff lubricant changed. Then 14k miles later the DPF Particulate filter becomes 100% full. I took it in and they said that the turbo was bad and the injectors are bad or need to be cleaned and this was why the DPF was full. They refused to cover and pay for the turbo or injector work because I did not change the original fuel filter at 15K miles originally and the bill would be 10,000 dollars. Can you believe that they want 3K just for a turbo and 700 dollars just for an injector! Also my Air-conditioning clutch was bad and they told me that it would cost me 1200 dollars because they just replace the whole pump as they dont sell just the AC clutch separately. Also the AC Fan was bad and that also need to be replaced at 100 dollars. I called the corporate office of Dodge and they said that they would not pay for the turbo or injector repairs because Tempe Dodge told them that I neglected servicing the vehicle so they will not cover the repairs. I told them that Tempe Dodge never told me that replacing a 70-dollar fuel filter when I had the truck in at 14k miles would void the Warranty. If they would have told me this don't you think I would have replaced it? They would not listen to me and just said they cannot cover it. I think that since the current fuel filter is still less than 15K miles that this issue is not my fault and is a defective part that Dodge should fix. After researching the 6.7L diesel I find out that many customers are having the very same problems and there is even a class action suit filed across 50 states against Dodge on the 6.7L from 2007 to 2010. Dodge and Tempe Dodge knows about this suit and still they will not fix my car. If you don't believe me just search Dodge 6.7L Ram problems and reviews and will see the truth. They are covering up original design problems and just leaving the customers flat out screwed! This is the real reason why Buy American is not followed any more by millions of Americans because companies like Dodge and dealers like Tempe Dodge.

In the original report, I see alot of this he said she said stuff.  Always get everything in writing.

The LAW requires WRITTEN ESTIMATES and also requires any denial of warranty service to be IN WRITING.

Verbal communications do absolutely nothing for you when it comes time to go to court.  As far as the initial problem you had, you most likely qualified under ARIZONA's lemon law to get that entire vehicle replaced as you went in several times for the same repair.  AND, the manufacturer spells out very specific repairs/ remedies for warranty covered items.

That turbo was obviously under warranty and should have been replaced.  No questions asked.

That service manager and/or warranty administrator at that location is obviously a moron.  It is highly unlikely that drilling a hole in the turbo was a mfg approved repair.

As far as the injectors go, 10k??

Really???

That is excessive by any standard.

Even if they were $500 each that's like $3000 plus labor, even at 8 hours and $100 an hour, that's $800. Tax and shop supplies, etc. another $500. That's just over $4,000 when priced at the highest conceivable pricing levels.

There is absolutely no way any injector job could be $10,000.  No way.

I worked in the service dept at a major dealership in big trucks and never saw a $10,000 rack of injectors.

You never mentioned the actual mileage on the engine and never mentioned any preventive maintenence.  However, in 2007, that was bad year for deisel engines as the new blends of deisel were mandated around that time, and the engines being sold were not really built for that new fuel.

You really need to use a good deisel additive to provide extra lubrication in any of today's fuels if you want to minimize failures.

Today's fuel sucks.

The dealer's mechanics know better than the customer what must be done at various intervals to avoid warranty voiding damage. This truck was in and out of their hands constantly for actual design related issues.

I have to assume they had the truck's maintenance records in their system.  At any time that they felt any component needed to be replaced to avoid such a disaster, if they didn't forcefully present the issue as imperative, to make the customer understand its necessity, then they bear at least a large part of the blame.  They are not doing their brand any favors here.

Again, I say, fix the dad blasted bloody truck and be done with it!

I have two problems with the response from the service advisor at Tempe Dodge.

First, her conclusion that all the problems are due to dirt in the fuel is purely speculation.  They did not disassemble anything and inspect it for dirt; they just noted that the fuel filter had not been changed and concluded that dirty fuel had made its way into the engine.

Second, that's not the way a fuel filter works.  If there is dirt in the fuel, the filter is supposed to catch it.  Using dirty fuel will cause the filter to eventually clog and no fuel will pass through.  The dealer says that dirt passed through the factory-installed filter and damaged the engine.  My only conclusion to that is that the original filter was defective as it failed to filter the fuel.  Therefore, Chrysler is responsible for the repairs.

The fuel filter on a CUMMINS is designed to hold about 2 Tablespoons of dirt. If the filter is not changed in the recommended time the dirt that the filter has trapped will make it past the media and into the injection system and eventually into the injectors and cause injector issues (sticking, miss-fire, etc:) This is NOT a design flaw with the filter as far as I know, it is designed that way because if a filter becomes plugged on a diesel engine and no fuel is allowed or fuel is restricted to the injection system then the entire injection system will be destroyed and need replaced. The diesel fuel is what lubricates and cools the injection system on a diesel engine so stopping fuel flow by designing a filter to plug up solid would not be a logical choice. It seems the engineers decided that it may be better to have a little dirty fuel enter the system and hope it gets a new filter soon or just damage a couple parts instead of destroying the entire system. The filter also strips water from the fuel that can cause rust in the injection system, Rust could also cause major damage to the injection system and would require part replacement. The filter should be drained of water every oil change or sooner. Was this ever done on the OP's truck? Did the filter have a defect or was it just working as designed? There is a process of maintenance that needs to be performed on every diesel truck (ford-chevy-dodge-isuzu-mercedes-etc:) that the owner of  the vehicle has to perform unless the maintenance is done on a regular basis by a qualified mechanic that knows the engine/vehicle and what needs to be done.

I am sorry to hear the truck has issues but I think it comes down to lack of maintenance. Diesel vehicles require more attention to services then a gas vehicle does and if it is neglected then things break.

Like maybe the design of the filter itself, or the assembly that holds it, is flawed.That's a terrible knife to thrust in the back of a customer.And your response is a good reason why America should just let whatever constitutes Chrysler today (be they the thieves who owned it before the bust, the Government, Fiat, I don't care) go belly up, bankrupt, dead and buried. Fix the bloody truck and convince the company you sell for to cover it.

The reason maintenance items are "recommended" and not "required" is that simply not doing a maintenance item is not enough cause to restrict (not VOID) your warranty.

However, not following maintenance recommendations that later result in major failures will, like installing non-approved accessories or a bad tank of gas, cause the manufacturer to decline the repair.  Unless the dirt is original factory equipment it is not covered by warranty.

That being said, the owner's automobile insurance may very well take care of the repairs under the comprehensive coverage.

Whether the OP and her husband strictly followed replacement "recommendations" or not, that model was clearly a problem from the get go, and Chrysler is screwing them. Chrysler has specialized in putting garbage on the road for decades.

How shameful from a company that once produced hot cars like the 69 Charger. And I remember the good ole days in the 80s when carburetors and injectors were a few hundred at most, and before then a simple carb was a hundred or so. Why do they keep designing vehicles whose non drive-train components now cost so much to replace?

Biggest problem is all the car makers are garbage today, Honda and Toyota included based on recalls. Even Nissan and Subaru have issues. You can't escape. That said, I'd still go with one of the Japanese brands over the so-called American companies, hardly any product of which is really made here anyway. Even in the 80s my so called American big Ford was really Canadian. They're all phony baloneys.

I bought a 2007 Dodge Ram 2500 6.7 L Diesel and have had major problems from day one with the Turbo and the PDF and Injectors. It started at 5K miles and has never been able to be fixed. I had the truck in 5 times and the engine light has never been off for more than 3 months. They replaced many components and they even drilled a hole in the turbo just to clean it. Does that sound like a fix to you? Now the Dodge dealer will not fix my bad turbo because they said that I did not change the fuel filter every 15K miles, but no one told me that it would void my warranty. And Dodge never gave me a owners manual, how convenient to keep the customer in the dark and then have the dealer not tell you what will void you warranty so that you will not have to cover your problems. Especially if it is a wide spread problem that they have no fix for. Dodge is basically committing fraud by selling to unsuspected customers for 4 years the 6.7L Turbo Diesel (2007 to 2010) and not telling the customers about their engine problems that they cannot fix. Case in point, there is a class action suit over this issue with 2007 to 2010 Cummins issues relating to the turbo that I am hoping they will lose and will be forced to have a recall for a new designed turbo, Exhaust, and injector system (Case no. : 8:10-201-HFF) in South Carolina. I called Corporate and they simply did not care that my Turbo went bad at 50K miles. I spent 38K on this truck 3 years ago and now it just sits in my driveway because I dont have 10K to fix it. I feel betrayed because I wanted buy an American car to help Dodge out when things were going tough for Dodge at that time. My family has work for Dodge for many years in Michigan and I was proud to own an American Car. Not now!, I fact I am thinking that I will never buy an American car again because I got simply screwed by Dodge and Tempe Dodge. Dodge will not admit that they have an issue with the 6.7 L Exhaust System and Turbo and Exhaust Filter, case in point is that Chrysler is trying to get the Class Action Complaint dismissed in court as you read this. Is this how dodge and the dealers conduct business, with a Lawyer instead of an engineer! I will make sure that my family, friends, and peers know how they screwed me and sold thousands of trucks with the same problem to unsuspected customers. If you don't believe me just look at the blogs about the 6.7L RAM, you will be shocked at how Dodge is screwing these customers and don't care. I do not have 10K just to replace the bad parts and even if I did, whats to say that the problem will be fixed. Now I have to trade the truck in and take a big loss. However, my loss will surely be Dodges loss in the end. Please do not buy these trucks, you will be sorry in the end.

what is optional for keeping the warranty in effect. The dealer shouldn't have to read the manual to the customer. All that would do is irritate the customer more. People MUST take responsibility...yes, I'm sorry this customer is having trouble, but looks like he may have contributed to the problems.  I hope something can be worked out.

A recommendation does not equate to a requirement. If changing various components is a requirement to uphold the warranty, then it should be put that way to a customer. He shouldn't be told its recommended, when the warranty demands it be required.
If indeed, the replacement of these filters is merely a recommendation, then the warranty ought to be honored. Otherwise, either your dealership or Chrysler is playing games, and deserving of a report for this.

As the Warranty Administrator at Tempe Dodge Chrysler Jeep it is my responsibility to ensure that all warranty repairs are performed per the manufacturers requirements. My failure to do so would result in the dealerships having to absorb the cost of repairs.
 
All automotive manufacturers have set maintenance intervals.  For instance, if your vehicle manufacturer requires an oil and filter change every 6,000 miles and you never do one, when you bring the vehicle into the shop with a knocking, sludged-up engine at 30,000 miles the manufacturer will decline to repair the problem under warranty stating lack of maintenance.  This is pretty much the situation here.
 
This vehicle did come in a few times after it was first sold.  There were issues with the turbo system (as is often the case during new design productions).  Chrysler, in conjunction with Cummins Diesel, decided that the drilling of the turbo was the approved method of dealing with some of the turbo problems.  As the owner states, this was done in November, 2008, at 19,000 miles.  The part for this repair had been ordered at 15,000 miles.  At that time the invoice states that a fuel filter replacement was recommended. (That information is also in the owners manualreplace fuel filter at every 15,000 mile interval.)
 
The next time we saw the vehicle was in April, 2010, at 36,000 miles.  At that time the customers invoice was noted with the following:
 
No maintenance historyoriginal fuel filter.  Customer advised to perform maintenance (air, fuel, and LOF).  Customer declined all maintenance and still using original fuel filter.  Customer advised of problems that may arise from dirt in fuel system and still declined filters at this time.
 
This is the root cause of the problem.  If maintenances had been performed per factory recommendations , the customer would not, in any way, be responsible for these repairs.  Chryslers stance at this point is that the failure MAY BE due to lack of maintenance, which MAY have been disproven if the customer had authorized the needed inspections.
 
We did everything we could to help the customer.  The turbo was even soaked overnight in an attempt to free up the slider ring.  This ring almost always will only jam if the injectors are not firing properly, something that is usually caused by dirt in the fuel system.
 
Now, we could have told the customer that he needed a turbo for $2,000.  After the customer authorized the repair and we replaced the turbo we could have called back and told him there was still an injector problem and that we needed to send them out for inspection.  That would have been another $600.  After he authorized that, we could have called back and told him that some injectors failed.  If those injectors had failed for an issue NOT involving dirt in the system, Chrysler would have picked up the ENTIRE tab.  If, however, an injector was plugged with dirt we would have attempted to clean it.  If it couldnt be cleaned wed have told the customer that he needed to replace anywhere from 1 to 6 injectors at a price of $1,500 each.  After that we would have still had to perform a regen.  The DPF was 80 to 90% plugged.  If that couldnt be done and the DPF (something like a catalytic converter) had to be replaced, that would have been another $2500.
 
Instead we chose to give the customer a worst-case scenario so he could make a rational, informed decision.  If I were a customer I would want to know in advance just how bad something could be, not being put in a position where you say well, I spent this, therefore I HAVE to spend that.
 
Im sorry for the length of this response, but I feel I could not explain the situation in less wordsI actually could have gone into a lot more detail!  I hope this clarifies some of the issues the writer brought up.  The new diesels, in response to federal clean-air requirements, are a different breed than the old 5.9 Cummins Diesel, but with proper care and maintenance are still very good, heavy-duty trucks.