Complaint Review: Wachovia Corporation Wachovia Bank N.A.

Thank you for taking the time to provide this information about your experience and exposing the nature of this predator. And thank you for taking on the bank front representatives.

I want to Thank Ripp-Off Report. I will keep you guys updated.

This Post is about Wachovia's negligence, lack of employee training, dangerous atmosphere they create and lack of concern for their customers. It is not about me. It is to warn others, as I wish I had been warned. It is to educate people that there are banks out there that care about their customers and that Wachovia is not one of them. You can spend MILLIONS on Propaganda like Wachovia is doing or you can simply provide a caring atmosphere and then have your customers tell their friends how great you are. Word of mouth is the BEST Advertisement. When you have to spend MILLIONS convincing people is when you have a problem; but then most Spiders do have to SPIN webs.

Scott,

I'm sorry to hear about the horrible situation you went through while at the bank. Thank you for letting everyone know your story, and the dangers to the customers when a bank uses security glass.

I hope you are able to make a full recover, and return to a normal active life.

As I stated earlier, there was an armed guard posted outside the bank, an armed guard not present on the day of the robbery. I had to talk to someone who was aware of what happened, no one around me could understand what was happening to me, and close out my account (which is another story in and of it self). I forced myself go back in. It was not an easy decision and I had beads of sweat all over me while I was in there, I have yet to put myself in that position again.

My Psychiatrist, who is certified by the United States District Court and who has been called on by that court to determine competency to stand trial in some high profile cases, explained to me that Post-Traumatic Stress Disorder is progressive and when you combine that with the fact I was still in shock. I am not a doctor and do not understand the workings of the mind, but my Psychiatrist is, and it is he who diagnosed me. I might add I thank-G_D every day I got help from him or I would have been dead. If you have ever experienced anything that takes over your life the way I have, you would understand, otherwise you can only speculate or distant yourself from the truth, the way Wachovia has.

If you were so traumatized by the robbery experience , why would you return in person? And then conduct business as usual? (completing your transaction with the teller)

Banks unlike Kentucky Fried Chickens, Hotels, and stores are required by Federal Law to train their employees/tellers to offer no resistance during a bank robbery and to follow proper procedure to ensure the safety of the customers and fellow employees. Banks are regulated as to opening and closing procedures and when they may open and who is required to be on property before opening and conducting business. Many People do not know about the laws that govern Banks.

PART 568 -- SECURITY PROCEDURES UNDER THE BANK PROTECTION ACT

Sec.
568.1 Authority, purpose, and scope.
568.2 Designation of security officer.
568.3 Security program.
568.4 Report.
568.5 Protection of customer information.

?568.3 Security program.
(a) Contents of security program. The security program shall:

(1) Establish procedures for opening and closing for business and for the safekeeping of all currency, negotiable securities, and similar valuables at all times;

(3) Provide for initial and periodic training of officers and employees in their responsibilities under the security program and in proper employee conduct during and after a burglary, robbery, or larceny; and

Buddy, Thank-You for your input

I went to ask her if they had any counseling available. She greeted me by name as I entered the bank and asked how I was doing. I told her I was not doing too well, then I asked her about any counseling the bank may have offered. She responded by turning her back on me and walking away. She walked behind the protective barrier and kept her back to me. I was so surprised; I just walked out after completing my transaction with the teller. I might add there was an armed security guard posted outside the bank that day or I would never have been able to even think of going back in; even then it was a huge step for me. My attorney at first only requested counseling, the response to that request was, we are sorry, but no. In my time since the robbery I have discover many banks offer counseling and many banks are aware of the danger bulletproof barriers create for there customers and emphasize teller training to overcome the danger during a robbery. I understand that everyone was threatened in that bank, even though it was my life they centered on. Some of the tellers urinated themselves from fear during the robbery and I am sure they were emotionally scarred and know the bank provided counseling. The bank manager that I spoke to was not there during the robbery; she was late for work that morning and was waiting outside the employee entrance, located behind the barrier, during the robbery. She could have offered something, a phone number at the very least. Instead, Wachovia would rather spend thousands on hiring a personal injury law firm of their own to fight, instead of offering any assistance. Someone has to stand-up to this abuse.

The Issue and the purpose of this Post are? When you walk into a Bank that uses bulletproof barriers, beware of the position it puts you in. You are trapped outside the barrier, in the lobby to be murdered to overcome that barrier. There are plenty of banks out there that refuse to create that danger and you need to be aware that you do have a choice. Take-over bank robberies are growing at an alarming rate. As long as no one does anything about the danger Wachovia and other banks like them are, putting the customers in, it will continue to happen. The barriers, erected to cut down on the single person robberies that usually net a couple thousand dollars, instead have created an atmosphere where theirs customers' lives are being used to overcome that barrier and the robbers get away with huge sums. The robbery I was held hostage in, the robbers had a huge camping backpack and it was filled-to-overflowing with money, so heavy two gunmen had to drag it out the door. Now violent, multiple perpetrator robberies are occurring and larger amounts are taken. People need to be aware of the danger that they are facing. I am not seeking sympathy as Michelle of Wachovia tried to imply. I want people to read my story, so they can be aware of how unexpectedly, in a matter of minutes, their lives can be turned upside-down and Wachovia will turn their back on them too. There are plenty of banks that do put their customers' safety first and do offer help should a robbery occur; Wachovia is not one of them. You have a choice in this matter, unlike some life changing horrors that come at you.

I pray your wife is doing well Buddy. The mind is more fragile than we are willing to admit. I would have never thought my experience would have the control that it has over me and I hate fearing anything.

In my opinion, I think that as a courtesy to the customers who were in the bank, a few sessions of counseling would not have been too much to ask for, and would probably be covered by the bank's insurance policy -- no different than if someone had come into the bank and slipped and fell on the too-polished floor.

However, you are assuming, Scott, that the bank has a duty to do what hostage-takers demand. This is similar to a case in California a few years ago. A woman walked into a Kentucky Fried Chicken store and a robber walked in and put a gun to her head and demanded that the clerk open the safe. Clerk refused, saying he did not have the combination. The clerk refused for 20 minutes, then finally opened the safe. The woman sued KFC for the clerk putting her through h*** for 20 minutes when he could have opened the safe the minute the robber walked in.

The Calif. Court of Appeal ruled that the clerk had no duty to do what the robber told him to do. The reasoning of the Court of Appeal was that there is no limit to what someone with a gun to someone's head will ask people to do, and once you start creating a duty to do comply with gunman's demands, there is no end to that duty, no matter how outrageous the command. For example, Scott, there were two gunmen. Suppose one had put a gun to the head of one of the tellers, gave him or her the other gun, and told him or her to start shooting customers or else she herself would be killed. In your particular case, the gunmen wanted money, and it is your feeling that the bank could have easily complied with that request. However, it might not always be the money that some crazed person with a gun wants.

I know you have been through an ordeal, but the people you are really mad at -- the robbers, can't pay for anything you want. Does your state have a Victim's Assistance Program? Obviously, several years later, this is still affecting you. Not everyone who goes through a traumatic experience with getting PTSD and may not understand how it affects people. My wife nearly drowned at the beach 6 years ago when she was caught between rocks in a fast-rising tide. I wasn't there, but friends called me right away. She had some physical injuries from being battered by the waves onto the rocks, but it took her a year before she would ever even get into a swimming pool again, and she has never gone back to the beach. If you feel you need counseling, please seek out public health services to see what they can offer you.

I suffer from Post-Traumatic Stress disorder. I was and am still unable to recall most of the events that happened in a single thread of thought. There are parts I still have blank spaces, like what actually happened between the time the gunmen entered and I hit the wall, ending up in a sitting position with a rifle against my face. The incident flashes in bits and pieces. The events were written from notes and as I recalled details, one thought at a time. It is a weird thing, the mind. There was also a video tape of the lobby that recorded the event.

Scott, I must say I am disappointed by your assumptions and answers. I, as you inferred in the title of your last post, do not work at Wachovia. I have been nothing but kind and friendly in my responses. I simply am curious as to your motivesI thought that maybe because you just posted it something else had happened, I was not downplaying however what you went through to begin with.

You mentioned a lawyer, I was just wondering what happened, you provided the information and started this report, now when people are making inquiries you are defensive. It is as I expected though, trying to have a reasonable conversation with some is simply out of the question; apparently you are just looking for sympathy as a victim.

** I pray you know how I feel one day. **

That's interesting, so you pray one day I will be held at gunpoint, so I know what trauma you went through? Humm, I thought you were on this site simply to educate others so it won't happen to themyet you pray one day it will happen to me. All of this because instead of showing sympathy (bottom line, its all you wanted) I asked a few questions?!?

Moving on.

Here is a question for you Scott, Why did you write this report in the third person? When I first read it I thought you were a friend or relative of the customer involved. Please respond.

Michelle your efforts to down play the effects of the damage I incurred and am still suffering from, as you keep mentioning happened Two Years ago, are of no consequence. I pray you know how I feel one day. To wake up at night and see gunmen dressed in black surrounding your home. Waking up everyone from your night screams from being murdered in your dreams. Some nights you sleep for a couple of hours, some nights you do not sleep at all, when you do , in come the dreams. When the simple act of going into a crowded public place is almost impossible. To be sitting at at traffic light and see your car surrounded by gunmen and then realize you are having a daytime flash back. To have to carry protection with you because there is something uncontrolable in you brain that keep replaying and the fear comes out of no where.

If this posting keeps just one person from having to live this way, that is all I am looking for, Your bank Wachovia is obviously more interested in it's 6.64 Billion in profit (2005), that establishing a safer place to conduct business. The Banks that truley care about their customer safety and when a robbery does happen offer help to their customers, and there are many, have a much cleaner slate than Wachovia.

Michelle your efforts to down play the effects of the damage I incurred and am still suffering from, as you keep mentioning happened Two Years ago, are of no consequence. I pray you know how I feel one day. To wake up at night and see gunmen dressed in black surrounding your home. Waking up everyone from your night screams from being murdered in your dreams. Some nights you sleep for a couple of hours, some nights you do not sleep at all, when you do , in come the dreams. When the simple act of going into a crowded public place is almost impossible. To be sitting at at traffic light and see your car surrounded by gunmen and then realize you are having a daytime flash back. To have to carry protection with you because there is something uncontrolable in you brain that keep replaying and the fear comes out of no where.

If this posting keeps just one person from having to live this way, that is all I am looking for, Your bank Wachovia is obviously more interested in it's 6.64 Billion in profit (2005), that establishing a safer place to conduct business. The Banks that truley care about their customer safety and when a robbery does happen offer help to their customers, and there are many, have a much cleaner slate than Wachovia.

Michelle your efforts to down play the effects of the damage I incurred and am still suffering from, as you keep mentioning happened Two Years ago, are of no consequence. I pray you know how I feel one day. To wake up at night and see gunmen dressed in black surrounding your home. Waking up everyone from your night screams from being murdered in your dreams. Some nights you sleep for a couple of hours, some nights you do not sleep at all, when you do , in come the dreams. When the simple act of going into a crowded public place is almost impossible. To be sitting at at traffic light and see your car surrounded by gunmen and then realize you are having a daytime flash back. To have to carry protection with you because there is something uncontrolable in you brain that keep replaying and the fear comes out of no where.

If this posting keeps just one person from having to live this way, that is all I am looking for, Your bank Wachovia is obviously more interested in it's 6.64 Billion in profit (2005), that establishing a safer place to conduct business. The Banks that truley care about their customer safety and when a robbery does happen offer help to their customers, and there are many, have a much cleaner slate than Wachovia.

Michelle your efforts to down play the effects of the damage I incurred and am still suffering from, as you keep mentioning happened Two Years ago, are of no consequence. I pray you know how I feel one day. To wake up at night and see gunmen dressed in black surrounding your home. Waking up everyone from your night screams from being murdered in your dreams. Some nights you sleep for a couple of hours, some nights you do not sleep at all, when you do , in come the dreams. When the simple act of going into a crowded public place is almost impossible. To be sitting at at traffic light and see your car surrounded by gunmen and then realize you are having a daytime flash back. To have to carry protection with you because there is something uncontrolable in you brain that keep replaying and the fear comes out of no where.

If this posting keeps just one person from having to live this way, that is all I am looking for, Your bank Wachovia is obviously more interested in it's 6.64 Billion in profit (2005), that establishing a safer place to conduct business. The Banks that truley care about their customer safety and when a robbery does happen offer help to their customers, and there are many, have a much cleaner slate than Wachovia.

People who conduct business with a Bank that employs the use of Bulletproof barriers need to know of the danger they put themselves in by conducting transactions with those banks.

Take over Bank Robberies are on the rise since 1998:

Chicago Sun-Times July 25th 2005

And the FBI has noticed a "disturbing trend" in recent robberies.

"A more brazen bandit who wants to get away with a larger loot increasingly flashes a gun or takes over the entire bank rather than quietly handing a teller a note demanding money."

"That's what's on the increase: violent, takeover robberies," said FBI Special Agent Joseph Raschke, one of 16 people on a local Violent Crimes Task Force made up of police and federal agents. "You've got more [bank robbers] putting hands on employees or customers."

This increse coincides with the time some banks decided to start implementing Bulletproof barriers to deter single perpetrators, creating a new threat singling out their customers."

Paul Cromwell, a criminologist at Wichita State University

During the past five years, bank robberies have increased nationwide by as much as 10 percent a year. Paul Cromwell, a criminologist at Wichita State University, says the bad economy and more branch banks are two reasons why bank robberies have increased.

"Several things may account for this increase. Primarily the downturn in the economy across the nation has been responsible for a lot of increase in economic crimes. Branch banking has also been responsible. More and more small banks with less security have popped up around the country in the past 10 years."

Charles E. Schumer
United States Senator

"According to final 2003 data from the Nassau and Suffolk Police Departments, Long Island finished the year with 68 bank robberies, which is a 70% increase over the 40 bank robberies on Long Island in the year 2000 and a 45% increase over the 47 bank robberies on Long Island in the year 2002. In Suffolk County, bank robberies doubled from 18 in 2000 to 36 in 2003. Over the last year, bank robberies went up 38% in Suffolk from 26 in 2002 to 36 in 2003. In Nassau County, bank robberies went up 45% from 22 in 2000 to 32 in 2003. Over the last year, bank robberies went up 52% in Nassau, from a (record-low) 21 in 2002 to 32 in 2003."

I wish to state that there are many Banks that will not even consider bullitproof barriers and many bank security advisers that know of the threat they create to the bank customers and will not allow them to be installed. If People bank at one of those banks that put their customers safety first they have made an intelligent choice. To those who have never thought of just how those bullitproof barriers create a atmosphere of danger to them they need to be aware and be forewarned. That is the purpose and intent of this posting.

Scott-Daytona FL

Thanks for your response; however you only address one out of my four original questions. Would you please share your thoughts on the other threeI will repost them here:

I was just wondering why if this happened June 12, 2004 you are just reporting it on here now? Also you said you got an attorney, did you go to court? What was the outcome?

Scott-Sioux Falls, South Dakota

In the news release (which in fact several years old of course), does not state they were caught. Info can be found at:xxxx

There is also something in reference to a Scott and his experience at Dayton Beach News-Online Journal, however I am unable to get into the site and I am not sure if it is the Scott listed or not, however the blurb is posted below:

Daytona Beach News-Journal Online
Scott Reiser's visit to a ... way out of the Wachovia Bank on ... In the June 12, 2004, heist, the robbers -- whose ties with South Florida's...
xxx

PART 568 -- SECURITY PROCEDURES UNDER THE BANK PROTECTION ACT
Sec.
568.1 Authority, purpose, and scope.
568.2 Designation of security officer.
568.3 Security program.
568.4 Report.
568.5 Protection of customer information.

?568.3 Security program.
(a) Contents of security program. The security program shall:

(1) Establish procedures for opening and closing for business and for the safekeeping of all currency, negotiable securities, and similar valuables at all times;

(3) Provide for initial and periodic training of officers and employees in their responsibilities under the security program and in proper employee conduct during and after a burglary, robbery, or larceny; and

I didn't read anywhere in the act where the bank was neglectful in it's security or where they are required to assist customers during a loss incident.

From your complaint I would gather that any bank with a lobby should have armed guards at every entrance. Even banks with armed guards get robbed.

The bank is not responsible for you getting PTSD. It is the fault of the robbers. The bank is not responsible for getting robbed. It is the fault of the robbers.

All of this boils down to you being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

By the way, you didn't mention if the robbers were caught. If they were, you may have the option of taking civil action against them.


BANK PROTECTION ACT OF 1968

AN ACT

To provide security measures for banks and other financial institutions, and to provide for the appointment of the Federal Savings and Loan Insurance Corporation as receiver.

Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representatives of the United States of America in Congress assembled, That this Act may be cited as the "Bank Protection Act of 1968".

[Codified to 12 U.S.C. 1881 note]

[Source: Section 1 of the Act of July 7, 1968 (Pub. L. No. 90--389; 82 Stat. 294), effective July 7, 1968]

SEC. 2. As used in this Act the term "Federal supervisory agency" means--
(1) The Comptroller of the Currency with respect to national banks and district banks,
(2) The Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve System with respect to Federal Reserve banks and State banks which are members of the Federal Reserve System,
(3) The Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation with respect to State banks which are not members of the Federal Reserve System but the deposits of which are insured by the Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation and State savings associations, and
(4) The Director of the Office of Thrift Supervision with respect to Federal savings.

[Codified to 12 U.S.C. 1881]

[Source: Section 2 of the Act of July 7, 1968 (Pub. L. No. 90--389; 82 Stat. 294) effective July 7, 1968; as amended by section 744(h) of title VII of the Act of August 9, 1989 (Pub. L. No. 101--73; 103 Stat. 439), effective August 9, 1989]

SEC. 3. (a) Within six months from the date of this Act, each Federal supervisory agency shall promulgate rules establishing minimum standards with which each bank or savings and loan association must comply with respect to the installation, maintenance, and operation of security devices and procedures, reasonable in cost, to discourage robberies, burglaries, and larcenies and to assist in the identification and apprehension of persons who commit such acts.
(b) The rules shall establish the time limits within which banks and savings and loan associations shall comply with the standards.

[Codified to 12 U.S.C. 1882]

[Source: Section 3 of the Act of July 7, 1968 (Pub. L. No. 90--389; 82 Stat. 295), effective July 7, 1968; as amended by section 911(a) of title IX of the Act of August 9, 1989 (Pub. L. No. 101--73; 103 Stat. 478), effective August 9, 1989]

SEC. 4. The Federal supervisory agencies shall consult with
(1) insurers furnishing insurance protection against losses resulting from robberies, burglaries, and larcenies committed against financial institutions referred to in section 2, and
(2) State agencies having supervisory or regulatory responsibilities with respect to such insurers to determine the feasibility and desirability of premium rate differentials based on the installation, maintenance, and operation of security devices and procedures. The Federal supervisory agencies shall report to the Congress the results of their consultations pursuant to this section not later than two years after the date of enactment of this Act.

[Codified to 12 U.S.C. 1883]

[Source: Section 4 of the Act of July 7, 1968 (Pub. L. No. 90--389; 82 Stat. 295), effective July 7, 1968]

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SEC. 5. A bank or savings and loan association which violates a rule promulgated pursuant to this Act shall be subject to a civil penalty which shall not exceed $100 for each day of the violation.

[Codified to 12 U.S.C. 1884]

[Source: Section 5 of the Act of July 7, 1968 (Pub. L. No. 90--389; 82 Stat. 295), effective July 7, 1968]



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When you create a atmosphere where you put the life of your customers in danger, a situation where you have created an Inescapable-trap, a situation where you have negligently opened your place of business without an officer of the bank present and are conducting business, have obviously not trained your management and tellers according to the Bank Protection, 1968. Where the tellers from behind the barrier created to protect them and the banks money with absolutely no protection provided to their customers. The customer contanted instead in a trap created where the customer has to be used in a take-over robbery.
Yes, responsibility lies in the hands of the Bank.

I have already been contacted by a party wanting to interview me concerning this matter for their national show, due to an article that appeared in my hometown newspaper, and for some reason some west coast papers are interested. We will see where it goes from there.

bw/s

Hi there, I am so sorry to hear of your experience and hope all is well now for you. I was just wondering why if this happened June 12, 2004 you are just reporting it on here now? Also you said you got an attorney, did you go to court? What was the outcome? Do you feel it is all business responsibility to cover costs for mental-health counseling if a robbery happens on their propertyor just banks (or companies more likely to fall victim to robberies)?