- Report: #120564
Complaint Review: TOKYOCENTRAL - Steve Sare - Mililani Hawaii
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TOKYOCENTRAL - Steve Sare
94-164 Hokuala Pl Mililani, 96789-2324 Hawaii, U.S.A.
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TOKYOCENTRAL - Steve Sare ripoff dishonest and devious withholding refund due for canceled on-line order Mililani Hawaii
Below is a chronological event of my grievance:
Note: there are sentences in () are my personal expressions.
May 18, 2003 Initiated an order for some Japan manga books on-line.
May 22, 2003 Sent my personal check $90.20 to pay for the order.
Waited for order for 4 weeks because my past two order with TOKYOCENTRAL arrive to me within that time.
June 17, 2003 I received my cashed personal check in the mail. It was cashed May 28, 2003 by a TOKYOCENTRAL DBA account.
This puzzled me because my previous orders with the TOKYOCENTRAL arrived before my cashed check in the mail.
June 26, 2003 Sent an e-mail to find out why I have not received my order in the mail yet. They e-mailed the same day that a couple ordered mangas have not arrived yet to ship the entire order. They told me to wait a couple weeks.
August 1, 2003 I felt I waited long enough (about a month) without receiving a follow-up memo about the status of my order. I sent an e-mail wanting to know which particular manga is holding up my order.
August 2, 2003 TOKYOCENTRAL e-mailed that they have the couple ordered mangas missing from my order within a few days after my June 26, 2003 e-mail. TOKYOCENTRAL claimed having problem shipping the order from Japan to US. It started late June and the beginning of July. The drop-shipper in Japan ceased operation and TOKYOCENTRAL can not find a replacement. TOKYOCENTRAL offered me a choice to ship my order, by SAL, AIRMAIL, or EMS via the regular postal system.
September 9, 2003 E-mailed to TOKYOCENTRAL to send my order by EMS.
October 7, 2003 After still not receiving my order. I e-mailed TOKYOCENTRAL to cancel my order and send my refund of $90.20. I send the same e-mail on October 10 & 12 with no reply from TOKYOCENTRAL.
October 27, 2003 TOKYOCENTRAL finally e-mailed saying they want to Look into my order and questions (There is no question, I want to cancel my order and receive my refund because TOKYOCENTRAL fail to deliver on their end.) TOKYOCENTRAL wrote wanting some time to get back to me with the proper solution . Claiming it's my fault I paid by personal check instead of by credit card. Claiming my reimbursement is not a simple process. (TOKYOCENTRAL reimbursed me for shipping their mix-up order back to them with a check in my second order in the year 2002.) Now, TOKYOCENTRAL claim to want to look into the right way of getting a check-as-refund to me. Ending their message they will write again, directly via e-mail with full details .
December 2, 2003 Over a month has passed and no e-mail from TOKYOCENTRAL to resolve this matter. I e-mailed to TOKYOCENTRAL stating this. During October and November 2003, I ordered 80% of the mangas, which I had ordered from TOKYOCENTRAL, on-line from JLIST.com and JPQUEEN.com. I received those orders 4 weeks. I notify TOKYOCENTRAL in the e-mail. I ordered somewhere else for the mangas. I also notify TOKYOCENTRAL I can not wait a year for this to resolve. I will be contacting the Better Business Bureau of Hawaii to help resolve this issue.
December 1, 2003 (time difference in Japan) This Steve Sare received my e-mail and began apologizing for FORGETTING about my concern not resolved. He states TOKYOCENTRAL is in process of receiving NEW checks from the bank. Once this occurs, they will promptly send the refund by EMS to insure fast delivery and confirmation of delivery.
Over a month passed, in January 2004, I decided to contact the Better Business Bureau (BBB) of Hawaii to present my claim against TOKYOCENTRAL (S.Sare)
February 29, 2004, after several attempts earlier by the BBB to contact S.Sare, The BBB sent me a C.C. mail. TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sare) response is appalling. TOKYOCENTRAL told the BBB they wrote to me EVERDAY regarding my concern is a lie. (I am the one initiate the correspondence when I have not heard from TOKYOCENTRAL month after time.) Steve Sare's e-mail claim TOKYOCENTRAL had shipped my order is a lie. (There was no mentioning of TOKYOCENTRAL sending my order in previous e-mail correspondences.) Steve Sare claims I hold TOKYOCENTRAL responsible for the MISSING order package (again a lie) and that TOKYOCENTRAL offered a refund to me (I was the one demanding my refund undelivered order see October 7, 2003 chronological above.) He claims TOKYOCENTRAL can not write a US check for the refund. (Even though, TOKYOCENTRAL has a DBA account at Bank One. If TOKYOCENTRAL can not make a check, certainly, Japan has an International Postal Money Order (IPMO) like the US?) Steve Sare claims their option were Bank to Bank wire transfer, or Remittance from Japan, which I will have to pay the fee.
Below is a pasted C.C. mail copy of Steve Sare's final e-mail response to my complaint to the BBB of Hawaii:
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TokyoCentral: S. Sare
> Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 4:21 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: To: Pearl Malalis, Service Representative
>
>
> Dear Pearl Malalis, Service Representative:
>
> This message is in regards to Mr. Michael G.'s claim that has been filed with the Better Business Bureau (BBB), Hawaii against TokyoCentral.
>
> I apologize for the delay in responding. I am in Japan and my father has just informed my of the letter that was sent to the Hawaii address. For reference, see the end of this email.
>
> My name is Steven Sare, and I own and operate TokyoCentral. The issue has been brought to my attention, that Mr. G has brought the BBB into this matter. First, it is a relief to have a neutral party involved. However, I'm not sure how this will benefit Mr. G.
>
> I am located in Tokyo, Japan. All operations of TokyoCentral are conducted and based from Japan. The address in Hawaii is my permanent address; US address; and my parent's address. It is used for my domain registrations and when I need a US address only. I am from the US (Mililani, Hawaii) but have been living in Japan for about five years now (since 1999).
>
> In regards to Mr. G, there are discrepancies that I would like to address. I have communicated with Mr. G a number of times. If writing everyday is ignoring, then I am guilty however the last message I wrote asked Mr. G to notify me of how to refund the payment. I was not instructed on Mr. G's preference.
>
> Mr. Grandberry paid by US Check, at the time the order was placed. At that time, we accepted US Checks but no longer do this nor have the method of cashing them. The order included shipping, from Japan, for the goods purchased. We sent the order as planned and via the shipping method Mr.G opted for. This method of shipping does not include insurance and we clearly state this on our Terms of Use that all customers must agree to prior to submitting an order. Our Terms of Use also clearly states that TokyoCentral is not liable once the package is sent from Japan, as this becomes the courier's responsibility.
>
> When we were notified of Mr. G's order not being received, we offered Mr. G a replacement. This is out of our generosity to complete Mr. G order, not a requirement. After exchanging emails a few times, it was clear Mr. G was holding TokyoCentral responsible for the missing package. This is when we offered a refund.
>
> The problem is, we do not have a way to simply write out a check. We do not have the ability to write US Checks from Japan. Other options were looked into, but Mr. G would have to pay high premiums in order to
receive this refund. The optional methods are Bank to Bank Wire Transfer, or Remittance from Japan. Both methods are not free; are services that charge depending various things. It could turn out to be more than the refund amount. This is where we, Mr. G and TokyoCentral, last communicated. We would like Mr. G to notify us about how to issue the refund.
>
> I'm not sure about how the BBB can help. Under TokyoCentral's Terms of Use, we have completed our required services. This is all clearly stated on our site and Mr. G is fully aware of this information. We decided to consume the loss twofold by offering a way to close the issue.
>
> Please let me know how we can proceed to bring closure. I am probably just as frustrated with this issue as Mr. G. I do hope you can be of assistance in this matter.
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Steven Sare
>
> 94-164 HOKUALA PL
> MILILANI, HI 96789-2324
> USA
>
March 1, 2004 After receiving the e-mail above, I sent my reply to the BBB of Hawaii of what I think about TOKYOCENTRAL's response. Include mentioning the IPMO idea.
Below is a pasted copy of my response to the C.C. mail I had received from the BBB of Hawaii:
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael G
To: Pearl Malalis
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 8:43 PM
Subject: Re: Complaint for Tokyocentral by Michael G
After reading the document you sent me, I am absolute appalled by his or the company's statement about my issue. I am clearly not satisfied with the company's response. The last message I receive was on 12/1/2003. They claim they have sent me mail a numerous time, everyday, is false. I have to initiate a response by sending a mail to let them know I still waiting.
He or they states they was negotiating with me to replace my (lost) order. That is a bunch of bull. There never was a mail sent to me with such an offer!! Attach is a copy of the previous correspondence I filed from
5/18/2003 to 10/27/2003. (note: put the other files in separate folder, if necessary, to view with [ .htm ] file as a web page.)
Let you be the judge.
I also made an attach copy of the last email (12/1/2003) copied as [ .txt ] file.
I asked for my $90.20 refund in Money Order. He or they did not gave me an straight answer in the last email. Don't Japan have international money order? It cost me $3.85 fee to pay for a International Postal Money Order
(IPMO) in the United States. I don't think it cost $100 USD in fee in Japan.
He or they gave me a choice to pay by check or credit. They did not state their insistent I pay by credit in their order form. Trying to blame me at fault for this situation is just appalling.
m.g.
March 20, 2004 I resent my e-mail response fearing the BBB of Hawaii may not receive my mail earlier.
March 22, 2004 The BBB of Hawaii sent an e-mail to me. Informing me that Steve Sare had stopped responding to the BBB's e-mails. The BBB decide to close my case as an unresolved complaint.
I decide to take this matter to the Department of Commerce and Consumer Affairs, Office of Consumer Protection, in Hawaii.
April 28, 2004 Mailed my complaint to the Office of Consumer Protection in Hawaii by US Postal Service.
May 17, 2003 J. Dooman, a representative from Office of Consumer Protection e-mailed me to check if there any communication between me and TOKYOCENTRAL. I reply the same day there was no communication since March 2004. My complaint is Case No. OCP-2004-0527
May 18, 2004 J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of his attempts to contact Steve Sare of (TOKYOCENTRAL)
June 4, 2004 - J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of his attempts to contact Steve Sare of (TOKYOCENTRAL)
June 10, 2004 J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of Steve Sara reply. He said he want to gather documents to reply. And have the audacity to tell Mr. Dooman ...the person filing the claim is not accurate, biased and has fabricated events.
July 8, 2003 - J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of his attempts to contact Steve Sare of (TOKYOCENTRAL) after waiting nearly a month for his prepared reply. His reply was using PART of the e-mail correspondences from August 2, 2003 to Dec 2, 2003 (skipping October 7, 2003) and his reply to the BBB of Hawaii on February 29, 2004 and my reply to his reply March 1, 2004 (see above chronological)
July 13, 2004 J. Dooman e-mailed me a C.C. mail, trying to get Steve Sare to commit to my entitlement for my refund.
July 16, 2004 Steve Sare replied claiming it is too complicated for TOKYOCENTRAL to obtain a checkbook in Japan. (TOKYOCENTRAL has a DBA bank account.) He STATES ...My offer for sending a refund (check) was to simply end the issue at hand. It was never an indication or admission that we were wrong. However, for the record, we never completed the process to obtain the checks. (All that time since December 2, 2003 was a hoax. Never even considered the IPMO idea in my March 1, 2004 reply.) Plus, making accusation about my request to ship my order to PO Box under a name Mike Berry may have obtain my order without my knowledge. (Fact is, the PO Box is my under a DBA shows his attempts to evade accountability.) Plus, he start to question my character by saying I may not claim to have received the refund sent by him. (How do I know if he sent the $90.20 refund in the first place when he claims he sent it?)
July 22, 2004 I e-mailed my response to TOKYOCENTRAL accusation through J. Dooman about Mike Berry may be responsible for my order ( WHICH IT WAS NEVER SENT TO ME! ).
August 3, 2004 J. Dooman sent me a C.C. mail about his attempt to contact TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sara)
August 4, 2004 Steve Sare CLAIMS to send two e-mails earlier in response. In his response was a lengthy description of TOKYOCENTRAL shipping problem. He got his wife involve to explain his company's problem, since late 2002 when TOKYOCENTRAL mix-up my order with a Michael Grand up to the time their drop-shipping business was cancelled. (See chronological in August 2, 2003 and October 27, 2003) He fail to mention my $90.20 refund due to me for canceled order. J. Dooman noticed this and sent an e-mail to Steve Sare about it.
August 12, 2004 Steve Sare CLAIMS he sent three e-mails in response to J. Dooman. His message was wanting to know HIS legal obligations. ( a delaying tactic ) J. Dooman responded with the same message sent on August 4th, plus, stating he is not a lawyer to give legal consultation.
August 25, 2004 J. Dooman sent a C.C. mail about his attempt to contact Steve Sare (TOKYOCENTRAL). His message sounded urgent to complete his investigation.
August 30, 2004 J. Dooman sent a C.C. mail of Steve Sare's response. I can not summarize his response because of the blatant audacity within in. The following are pasted paragraphs of TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sare) final message to J. Dooman, investigator for the Office of Consumer Protection.
Dear James C Dooman:
Thank you for writing, I apologize for the delay in responding. My thoughts remain the same, in regards to Mr. G's complaint, as stated in the documentaion you've received from me during this course.
I not only sent two orders to the customer, but did all I could to bring closure to this situation. I am not willing to refund any amount as I do not feel I am wrong. Mr. G is not being punished! How are you so sure Mr. G has not received the order in question? I've attempted to bring closure and have, in the past, offered to send a refund. Another reason the refund didn't occur was because there was no way for an outside party (namely the BBB) would not "witness" the payment. For what ever reason, Mr. G hold TokyoCentral responsible, when out Terms of Use clearly states we are not responsible for lost or damaged packages that are not insured.
If, now, I am required by law (namely, you, the government) to easily supply more money to Mr. G, then so be it! I am being very defensive because I feel that I'm being punished, held liable, and looked at as criminal, when I've done more than may part in this case!
If I am wrong, you need to say it. Have you read the messages (all of them) that I've sent to you? You said in the beginning that you are investigating to determine if Mr. G is entitled to a refund. I think you need to tell me what is required to be done next. What is the outcome?
Regards,
Steven Sare
TokyoCentral
http://www.tokyocentral.com
That last message is a lie there were no mentioning of sending TWO package in all the e-mail correspondence before the BBB of Hawaii and the Office of Consumer Protection got involve it this matter. He did not say when he sent them or which USPS office he sent the package so they can be traced. Steve Sare know the truth. His tactic of delaying his response to the deadline with the Office of Consumer Protection and with the BBB of Hawaii SHOULD make him look like a criminal. He tells me I am entitled for the refund (see chronological December 1, 2003) now he decide to deny my refund due. He claims HE is the one being punished, (For NEVER sending my order and keeping my money?!). Claiming he has done more on his part to resolve this case is ridiculous. I order from TOKYOCENTRAL twice in 2002, return their mix-up order in good faith, and this kind of treatment I get. I want this matter settle, but not by lies and distorted stories he presented making himself a lying innocent victim. He even ignored my suggestion to send me a $90.20 International Postal Money Order (IPMO) as refund payment. (see chronological March 1, 2004 and July 16, 2004)
September 5, 2004 I e-mailed J. Dooman expressing my outrage. After I received a postmarked mail from him dated August 31, 2004 (note: Steve Sare sent his e-mail reply on August 30th). It arrived to me on September 4, 2003. J. Dooman claims he is unable to resolve the matter (Case No. OCP-2004-0527) within the time period. As I said earlier, Steve Sare had timed his reply to the Case's deadline cunningly. I intend to alert every channel possible on the World Wide Web of TOKYOCENTRAL treachery of refusing to pay $90.20 due to me. I am not going to let this matter die unjustly for his benefit.
The knowledge I gain from this matter about, TOKYOCENTRAL, it is a small time online sell-from-your-garage business. It is not a big outfit online like JLIST.com, ANIMENATION.com, and COMIKET.com. Or an honorable self-business online like JPQUEEN.com and MANDARAKE.com. They are the ones I will do business regularly in the future.
Readers, after reading my complaint avoid doing business with this TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sare). If you are a Japan manga or dojin fan, I suggest joining an online membership, which can cost you between $20 to $30 an month. You can save money that way. Check the Better Business Bureau or other Consumer Protection Service before dealing with unknown small time online business, such as, TOKYOCENTRAL. You can view the full record of this matter from the Office of Consumer Protection, Dept. Of Commerce and Consumer Affairs, www.hawaii.gov/dcca/ocp, Case No. OCP-2004-0527 and from the Better Business Bureau of Hawaii.
I apologize for making this report so long. I feel you should know what I endure from this ripoff.
Michael
saginaw, Michigan
U.S.A.
STOP! ..before you think about using the Better Business Bureau (BBB)... CLICK HERE to see how other consumers were victimized by the BBB's false or misleading information. Don't be fooled! It has been reported, when there are thousands of complaints and other investigations underway by authorities, the BBB has no choice but to finally give an UNsatisfactory rating to a BBB member business that is paying the BBB big membership fees every year. When a business is reported that is NOT a BBB member, BBB files WILL more likely show an UNsatisfactory rating, then reportedly shake down that company to become a member of the BBB. One positive thing about the BBB is, either way, if a business has an unsatisfactory rating with the BBB, you can be sure, the business is bad. But what about all those BBB member businesses that had complaints filed against them? Consumers never get to hear about them. What about the BBB advertising to the public? Is this a false and misleading perception they are giving about consumer confidence when dealing with a business? Click here to understand more of what consumers and business alike are saying about the BBB. You decide. ..Remember. The BBB membership is not earned, it's paid for!
Note: there are sentences in () are my personal expressions.
May 18, 2003 Initiated an order for some Japan manga books on-line.
May 22, 2003 Sent my personal check $90.20 to pay for the order.
Waited for order for 4 weeks because my past two order with TOKYOCENTRAL arrive to me within that time.
June 17, 2003 I received my cashed personal check in the mail. It was cashed May 28, 2003 by a TOKYOCENTRAL DBA account.
This puzzled me because my previous orders with the TOKYOCENTRAL arrived before my cashed check in the mail.
June 26, 2003 Sent an e-mail to find out why I have not received my order in the mail yet. They e-mailed the same day that a couple ordered mangas have not arrived yet to ship the entire order. They told me to wait a couple weeks.
August 1, 2003 I felt I waited long enough (about a month) without receiving a follow-up memo about the status of my order. I sent an e-mail wanting to know which particular manga is holding up my order.
August 2, 2003 TOKYOCENTRAL e-mailed that they have the couple ordered mangas missing from my order within a few days after my June 26, 2003 e-mail. TOKYOCENTRAL claimed having problem shipping the order from Japan to US. It started late June and the beginning of July. The drop-shipper in Japan ceased operation and TOKYOCENTRAL can not find a replacement. TOKYOCENTRAL offered me a choice to ship my order, by SAL, AIRMAIL, or EMS via the regular postal system.
September 9, 2003 E-mailed to TOKYOCENTRAL to send my order by EMS.
October 7, 2003 After still not receiving my order. I e-mailed TOKYOCENTRAL to cancel my order and send my refund of $90.20. I send the same e-mail on October 10 & 12 with no reply from TOKYOCENTRAL.
October 27, 2003 TOKYOCENTRAL finally e-mailed saying they want to Look into my order and questions (There is no question, I want to cancel my order and receive my refund because TOKYOCENTRAL fail to deliver on their end.) TOKYOCENTRAL wrote wanting some time to get back to me with the proper solution . Claiming it's my fault I paid by personal check instead of by credit card. Claiming my reimbursement is not a simple process. (TOKYOCENTRAL reimbursed me for shipping their mix-up order back to them with a check in my second order in the year 2002.) Now, TOKYOCENTRAL claim to want to look into the right way of getting a check-as-refund to me. Ending their message they will write again, directly via e-mail with full details .
December 2, 2003 Over a month has passed and no e-mail from TOKYOCENTRAL to resolve this matter. I e-mailed to TOKYOCENTRAL stating this. During October and November 2003, I ordered 80% of the mangas, which I had ordered from TOKYOCENTRAL, on-line from JLIST.com and JPQUEEN.com. I received those orders 4 weeks. I notify TOKYOCENTRAL in the e-mail. I ordered somewhere else for the mangas. I also notify TOKYOCENTRAL I can not wait a year for this to resolve. I will be contacting the Better Business Bureau of Hawaii to help resolve this issue.
December 1, 2003 (time difference in Japan) This Steve Sare received my e-mail and began apologizing for FORGETTING about my concern not resolved. He states TOKYOCENTRAL is in process of receiving NEW checks from the bank. Once this occurs, they will promptly send the refund by EMS to insure fast delivery and confirmation of delivery.
Over a month passed, in January 2004, I decided to contact the Better Business Bureau (BBB) of Hawaii to present my claim against TOKYOCENTRAL (S.Sare)
February 29, 2004, after several attempts earlier by the BBB to contact S.Sare, The BBB sent me a C.C. mail. TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sare) response is appalling. TOKYOCENTRAL told the BBB they wrote to me EVERDAY regarding my concern is a lie. (I am the one initiate the correspondence when I have not heard from TOKYOCENTRAL month after time.) Steve Sare's e-mail claim TOKYOCENTRAL had shipped my order is a lie. (There was no mentioning of TOKYOCENTRAL sending my order in previous e-mail correspondences.) Steve Sare claims I hold TOKYOCENTRAL responsible for the MISSING order package (again a lie) and that TOKYOCENTRAL offered a refund to me (I was the one demanding my refund undelivered order see October 7, 2003 chronological above.) He claims TOKYOCENTRAL can not write a US check for the refund. (Even though, TOKYOCENTRAL has a DBA account at Bank One. If TOKYOCENTRAL can not make a check, certainly, Japan has an International Postal Money Order (IPMO) like the US?) Steve Sare claims their option were Bank to Bank wire transfer, or Remittance from Japan, which I will have to pay the fee.
Below is a pasted C.C. mail copy of Steve Sare's final e-mail response to my complaint to the BBB of Hawaii:
> -----Original Message-----
> From: TokyoCentral: S. Sare
> Sent: Sunday, February 29, 2004 4:21 AM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: To: Pearl Malalis, Service Representative
>
>
> Dear Pearl Malalis, Service Representative:
>
> This message is in regards to Mr. Michael G.'s claim that has been filed with the Better Business Bureau (BBB), Hawaii against TokyoCentral.
>
> I apologize for the delay in responding. I am in Japan and my father has just informed my of the letter that was sent to the Hawaii address. For reference, see the end of this email.
>
> My name is Steven Sare, and I own and operate TokyoCentral. The issue has been brought to my attention, that Mr. G has brought the BBB into this matter. First, it is a relief to have a neutral party involved. However, I'm not sure how this will benefit Mr. G.
>
> I am located in Tokyo, Japan. All operations of TokyoCentral are conducted and based from Japan. The address in Hawaii is my permanent address; US address; and my parent's address. It is used for my domain registrations and when I need a US address only. I am from the US (Mililani, Hawaii) but have been living in Japan for about five years now (since 1999).
>
> In regards to Mr. G, there are discrepancies that I would like to address. I have communicated with Mr. G a number of times. If writing everyday is ignoring, then I am guilty however the last message I wrote asked Mr. G to notify me of how to refund the payment. I was not instructed on Mr. G's preference.
>
> Mr. Grandberry paid by US Check, at the time the order was placed. At that time, we accepted US Checks but no longer do this nor have the method of cashing them. The order included shipping, from Japan, for the goods purchased. We sent the order as planned and via the shipping method Mr.G opted for. This method of shipping does not include insurance and we clearly state this on our Terms of Use that all customers must agree to prior to submitting an order. Our Terms of Use also clearly states that TokyoCentral is not liable once the package is sent from Japan, as this becomes the courier's responsibility.
>
> When we were notified of Mr. G's order not being received, we offered Mr. G a replacement. This is out of our generosity to complete Mr. G order, not a requirement. After exchanging emails a few times, it was clear Mr. G was holding TokyoCentral responsible for the missing package. This is when we offered a refund.
>
> The problem is, we do not have a way to simply write out a check. We do not have the ability to write US Checks from Japan. Other options were looked into, but Mr. G would have to pay high premiums in order to
receive this refund. The optional methods are Bank to Bank Wire Transfer, or Remittance from Japan. Both methods are not free; are services that charge depending various things. It could turn out to be more than the refund amount. This is where we, Mr. G and TokyoCentral, last communicated. We would like Mr. G to notify us about how to issue the refund.
>
> I'm not sure about how the BBB can help. Under TokyoCentral's Terms of Use, we have completed our required services. This is all clearly stated on our site and Mr. G is fully aware of this information. We decided to consume the loss twofold by offering a way to close the issue.
>
> Please let me know how we can proceed to bring closure. I am probably just as frustrated with this issue as Mr. G. I do hope you can be of assistance in this matter.
>
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Steven Sare
>
> 94-164 HOKUALA PL
> MILILANI, HI 96789-2324
> USA
>
March 1, 2004 After receiving the e-mail above, I sent my reply to the BBB of Hawaii of what I think about TOKYOCENTRAL's response. Include mentioning the IPMO idea.
Below is a pasted copy of my response to the C.C. mail I had received from the BBB of Hawaii:
----- Original Message -----
From: Michael G
To: Pearl Malalis
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 8:43 PM
Subject: Re: Complaint for Tokyocentral by Michael G
After reading the document you sent me, I am absolute appalled by his or the company's statement about my issue. I am clearly not satisfied with the company's response. The last message I receive was on 12/1/2003. They claim they have sent me mail a numerous time, everyday, is false. I have to initiate a response by sending a mail to let them know I still waiting.
He or they states they was negotiating with me to replace my (lost) order. That is a bunch of bull. There never was a mail sent to me with such an offer!! Attach is a copy of the previous correspondence I filed from
5/18/2003 to 10/27/2003. (note: put the other files in separate folder, if necessary, to view with [ .htm ] file as a web page.)
Let you be the judge.
I also made an attach copy of the last email (12/1/2003) copied as [ .txt ] file.
I asked for my $90.20 refund in Money Order. He or they did not gave me an straight answer in the last email. Don't Japan have international money order? It cost me $3.85 fee to pay for a International Postal Money Order
(IPMO) in the United States. I don't think it cost $100 USD in fee in Japan.
He or they gave me a choice to pay by check or credit. They did not state their insistent I pay by credit in their order form. Trying to blame me at fault for this situation is just appalling.
m.g.
March 20, 2004 I resent my e-mail response fearing the BBB of Hawaii may not receive my mail earlier.
March 22, 2004 The BBB of Hawaii sent an e-mail to me. Informing me that Steve Sare had stopped responding to the BBB's e-mails. The BBB decide to close my case as an unresolved complaint.
I decide to take this matter to the Department of Commerce and Consumer Affairs, Office of Consumer Protection, in Hawaii.
April 28, 2004 Mailed my complaint to the Office of Consumer Protection in Hawaii by US Postal Service.
May 17, 2003 J. Dooman, a representative from Office of Consumer Protection e-mailed me to check if there any communication between me and TOKYOCENTRAL. I reply the same day there was no communication since March 2004. My complaint is Case No. OCP-2004-0527
May 18, 2004 J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of his attempts to contact Steve Sare of (TOKYOCENTRAL)
June 4, 2004 - J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of his attempts to contact Steve Sare of (TOKYOCENTRAL)
June 10, 2004 J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of Steve Sara reply. He said he want to gather documents to reply. And have the audacity to tell Mr. Dooman ...the person filing the claim is not accurate, biased and has fabricated events.
July 8, 2003 - J. Dooman sent me a C.C. e-mail of his attempts to contact Steve Sare of (TOKYOCENTRAL) after waiting nearly a month for his prepared reply. His reply was using PART of the e-mail correspondences from August 2, 2003 to Dec 2, 2003 (skipping October 7, 2003) and his reply to the BBB of Hawaii on February 29, 2004 and my reply to his reply March 1, 2004 (see above chronological)
July 13, 2004 J. Dooman e-mailed me a C.C. mail, trying to get Steve Sare to commit to my entitlement for my refund.
July 16, 2004 Steve Sare replied claiming it is too complicated for TOKYOCENTRAL to obtain a checkbook in Japan. (TOKYOCENTRAL has a DBA bank account.) He STATES ...My offer for sending a refund (check) was to simply end the issue at hand. It was never an indication or admission that we were wrong. However, for the record, we never completed the process to obtain the checks. (All that time since December 2, 2003 was a hoax. Never even considered the IPMO idea in my March 1, 2004 reply.) Plus, making accusation about my request to ship my order to PO Box under a name Mike Berry may have obtain my order without my knowledge. (Fact is, the PO Box is my under a DBA shows his attempts to evade accountability.) Plus, he start to question my character by saying I may not claim to have received the refund sent by him. (How do I know if he sent the $90.20 refund in the first place when he claims he sent it?)
July 22, 2004 I e-mailed my response to TOKYOCENTRAL accusation through J. Dooman about Mike Berry may be responsible for my order ( WHICH IT WAS NEVER SENT TO ME! ).
August 3, 2004 J. Dooman sent me a C.C. mail about his attempt to contact TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sara)
August 4, 2004 Steve Sare CLAIMS to send two e-mails earlier in response. In his response was a lengthy description of TOKYOCENTRAL shipping problem. He got his wife involve to explain his company's problem, since late 2002 when TOKYOCENTRAL mix-up my order with a Michael Grand up to the time their drop-shipping business was cancelled. (See chronological in August 2, 2003 and October 27, 2003) He fail to mention my $90.20 refund due to me for canceled order. J. Dooman noticed this and sent an e-mail to Steve Sare about it.
August 12, 2004 Steve Sare CLAIMS he sent three e-mails in response to J. Dooman. His message was wanting to know HIS legal obligations. ( a delaying tactic ) J. Dooman responded with the same message sent on August 4th, plus, stating he is not a lawyer to give legal consultation.
August 25, 2004 J. Dooman sent a C.C. mail about his attempt to contact Steve Sare (TOKYOCENTRAL). His message sounded urgent to complete his investigation.
August 30, 2004 J. Dooman sent a C.C. mail of Steve Sare's response. I can not summarize his response because of the blatant audacity within in. The following are pasted paragraphs of TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sare) final message to J. Dooman, investigator for the Office of Consumer Protection.
Dear James C Dooman:
Thank you for writing, I apologize for the delay in responding. My thoughts remain the same, in regards to Mr. G's complaint, as stated in the documentaion you've received from me during this course.
I not only sent two orders to the customer, but did all I could to bring closure to this situation. I am not willing to refund any amount as I do not feel I am wrong. Mr. G is not being punished! How are you so sure Mr. G has not received the order in question? I've attempted to bring closure and have, in the past, offered to send a refund. Another reason the refund didn't occur was because there was no way for an outside party (namely the BBB) would not "witness" the payment. For what ever reason, Mr. G hold TokyoCentral responsible, when out Terms of Use clearly states we are not responsible for lost or damaged packages that are not insured.
If, now, I am required by law (namely, you, the government) to easily supply more money to Mr. G, then so be it! I am being very defensive because I feel that I'm being punished, held liable, and looked at as criminal, when I've done more than may part in this case!
If I am wrong, you need to say it. Have you read the messages (all of them) that I've sent to you? You said in the beginning that you are investigating to determine if Mr. G is entitled to a refund. I think you need to tell me what is required to be done next. What is the outcome?
Regards,
Steven Sare
TokyoCentral
http://www.tokyocentral.com
That last message is a lie there were no mentioning of sending TWO package in all the e-mail correspondence before the BBB of Hawaii and the Office of Consumer Protection got involve it this matter. He did not say when he sent them or which USPS office he sent the package so they can be traced. Steve Sare know the truth. His tactic of delaying his response to the deadline with the Office of Consumer Protection and with the BBB of Hawaii SHOULD make him look like a criminal. He tells me I am entitled for the refund (see chronological December 1, 2003) now he decide to deny my refund due. He claims HE is the one being punished, (For NEVER sending my order and keeping my money?!). Claiming he has done more on his part to resolve this case is ridiculous. I order from TOKYOCENTRAL twice in 2002, return their mix-up order in good faith, and this kind of treatment I get. I want this matter settle, but not by lies and distorted stories he presented making himself a lying innocent victim. He even ignored my suggestion to send me a $90.20 International Postal Money Order (IPMO) as refund payment. (see chronological March 1, 2004 and July 16, 2004)
September 5, 2004 I e-mailed J. Dooman expressing my outrage. After I received a postmarked mail from him dated August 31, 2004 (note: Steve Sare sent his e-mail reply on August 30th). It arrived to me on September 4, 2003. J. Dooman claims he is unable to resolve the matter (Case No. OCP-2004-0527) within the time period. As I said earlier, Steve Sare had timed his reply to the Case's deadline cunningly. I intend to alert every channel possible on the World Wide Web of TOKYOCENTRAL treachery of refusing to pay $90.20 due to me. I am not going to let this matter die unjustly for his benefit.
The knowledge I gain from this matter about, TOKYOCENTRAL, it is a small time online sell-from-your-garage business. It is not a big outfit online like JLIST.com, ANIMENATION.com, and COMIKET.com. Or an honorable self-business online like JPQUEEN.com and MANDARAKE.com. They are the ones I will do business regularly in the future.
Readers, after reading my complaint avoid doing business with this TOKYOCENTRAL (Steve Sare). If you are a Japan manga or dojin fan, I suggest joining an online membership, which can cost you between $20 to $30 an month. You can save money that way. Check the Better Business Bureau or other Consumer Protection Service before dealing with unknown small time online business, such as, TOKYOCENTRAL. You can view the full record of this matter from the Office of Consumer Protection, Dept. Of Commerce and Consumer Affairs, www.hawaii.gov/dcca/ocp, Case No. OCP-2004-0527 and from the Better Business Bureau of Hawaii.
I apologize for making this report so long. I feel you should know what I endure from this ripoff.
Michael
saginaw, Michigan
U.S.A.
STOP! ..before you think about using the Better Business Bureau (BBB)... CLICK HERE to see how other consumers were victimized by the BBB's false or misleading information. Don't be fooled! It has been reported, when there are thousands of complaints and other investigations underway by authorities, the BBB has no choice but to finally give an UNsatisfactory rating to a BBB member business that is paying the BBB big membership fees every year. When a business is reported that is NOT a BBB member, BBB files WILL more likely show an UNsatisfactory rating, then reportedly shake down that company to become a member of the BBB. One positive thing about the BBB is, either way, if a business has an unsatisfactory rating with the BBB, you can be sure, the business is bad. But what about all those BBB member businesses that had complaints filed against them? Consumers never get to hear about them. What about the BBB advertising to the public? Is this a false and misleading perception they are giving about consumer confidence when dealing with a business? Click here to understand more of what consumers and business alike are saying about the BBB. You decide. ..Remember. The BBB membership is not earned, it's paid for!
1 Updates & Rebuttals
V
Tokyo,Asia,
Japan
Mr. Michael Grandberry AKA MIKE BERRY
#2UPDATE Employee
Fri, January 06, 2006
Dear Mr. Grandberry, I am sorry to see to see that your issue continues. I have reviewed the sequence of events, and find your claim to be inaccurate and one-sided. If anything, I hope you have found some relief in personally slandering someone on the internet. It is obvious you are doing this to shame us into refunding a shipped order. We never refused to refund. However, you did refuse to accept any method of refund EXCEPT a US check. We could not provide you a US check, and you refused to incur any costs in accepting payment by bank transfer or International bank draft. It is true that we have had dealings in the past, but based on our records, each and every order was dramatic from day one. As a result, we had trouble believing many of your claims. However, in the end, we wanted to do the right thing. We did ship an order, and we already lost much more than the value of your order when you wanted more. We more than tried to compromise, and your insistance on receiving a US check under your terms made that impossible. We offered to send a refund to the BBB as witness. They could not oblige. We also offered to send the refund to J. Dooman. He could not be our witness either. According to the BBB, we were advised that we did fullfil our duties as a responsible business, and while the buyer may feel wronged, we are not obligated to take any further actions. As we already informed you, the company in California that handled TokyoCentral's drop-shipments and PO box for payments went out of business. At the time, orders were lost in limbo, including a package shipped to you. At the time, we offered a refund, or a reshipment. We stated that shipping would need to be changed to either Air, SAL, or EMS. We were in no position to pay the EMS fee for you, and as a result, we shipped SAL. Please note that we forwared a link for you to review your 'new' shipping options, and each method had a different fee attached. The books took a few weeks to ship as we worked through the change of shipping methods. No one forced or asked you to wait. According to our records, your order was submitted with this shipping address: MICHAEL GRANDBERRY 123 S 19TH ST SAGINAW, MI 48601-1442 After submission, the address was changed to: MIKE BERRY PO BOX 90246 BURTON, MI 48509-0246 We used the latter address as you requested. Again, we are more than happy to resolve this matter. However, we have already incurred significant cost for this order, and still can't send you a US check. Your insistence on receiving a US check with all costs paid by us has made you unreasonable. In fact, we fear sending any refund will not resolve this matter, and therefore, wanted a witness of receipt. However, either way, we still could not send you a US check, and informed you that you would incur bank fees to receive payment from us in Japan. You refused to accept this, and forced both the BBB and J. Dooman to close your case without resolution because you were not willing to budge at all. At this time, we still feel we fulfilled our job and provided you a service. You claim not to have received it, and we agreed to refund. However, we could not send you a check and at that point, we were more than trying to meet you part of the way. I am sorry you feel compelled to personally slander someone over this situation. To be frankly honest, your stance on this topic makes you extremely difficult, and your claims become more outrageous with time that we are forced to stand our ground. We once again offer to send funds by transfer. However, you should consult your bank first to find out the costs in accepting those funds, and notify us of your bank details. Sincerely.
