Complaint Review: Copper Canyon Labradoodles - Chemainus British Columbia

We are the guardian home for one of the breeding females for Copper Canyon Labradoodles. I researched carefully before choosing them.  Not only did this breeder check us out thoroughly, we checked her operation out too and decided to go with her.

We got our girl at 9 weeks old and she is almost 5 years old now.  She had her first litter when she was 2 and her second litter 15 months later. She will probably have one more than then be spayed.  This is NOT overbreeding.  Linda is a conscientious, caring, ethical breeder in my opinion.  

Our dog lives with us and goes back to Copper Canyon to be bred and then to have her puppies.  We can and do visit her when she is there and she lives in thsir home as part of their family and pack.  We don't give them a lot of notice when we visit - just call and say we are coming today. I have never seen anything that made me uncomfortable or concerned when I have visited.

I have seen an outdoor run where the dogs and puppies go once they are old enough to romp around. I have NEVER seen electrical wires or kennels.  I have seen up to 4 mothers with their puppies in various parts of her house at one time.  It is a bit crowded but then are all clean, well cared for and, certainly, our girl seems very happy when she is staying there in their home.   

I have nothing but good things to say about this breeder and the care she takes to make sure the puppies she produces are healthy, well balanced and beautiful dogs.  

I am simply a person who has done business with the Copper Canyon folks reported on.  I've had personal dealings with these folks and have only good to say! Their standing in the community doesn't affect my well-being directly, though it certainly saddens me to see this injustice in print.  Accusations leave a sting that is hard to forget. We need to be careful of the words we choose. I don't think the people you are writing about deserve these comments and I don't think the so-called "information" could be reliable.

 They really know their stuff, they are professional, they are as good as their word, and they have studied and worked and become extremely knowledgeable in their field. The field of creating new and wonderful labradoodles can't be a bad thing! I am quite confident thqt their dogs are respectfully cared for.

I won't comment again on this site. I hope my words have been heard. If they haven't, though, I won't continue to dignify this exchange.

(((Redacted)))

Ckeck out this topic, Is this breeder breeding for money or for what is best for the X breed dogs?

 Topics: Breeding each heat cycle

Jax

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Joined: 3/30/2009

 

 

 

 

Posted: 10:23:39 AM 3/30/2009

Hi,
Do you or your friend have the reference for the actual study?

huggsnkis3

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Joined: 4/24/2009

 

Posted: 10:52:10 AM 4/24/2009

I have a beautiful boxer. I waited until she could have all of her health tests completed before I had a litter from her. She did not go into heat for almost 2 years after her tests. While doing extensive research on the topic, I also read this information. The reason that it is considered better to mate them back to back is because, if she does not have a litter, her hormone changes will destroy her uterus. When she has a litter of pups, she does not have the severe hormonal changes. You do not have to have back to back litters to achieve the same goals. There are injections, as well as pills, you, or should I say she, can have that will prevent estrus, or her heat cycle. One of the drugs are called check drops. Dogs do not need the monthly "flushing out" of their system like humans do. I also found that breeders that used those drugs on their dogs were able to have older dogs, of 4 or 5, have uterus that were similar to uteruss of much younger female dogs. I guess you could say that they were "preserved" for lack of a better word. I am not a vet, but I needed to be well informed on my choices for my girl. I ended up going to Northview OH to have an Ovuplant inserted into my Snickers. It brought estrus in four days. It is too early to see if it worked! Wish us luck!!

Here is some info on the cheque drops

(((Redacted)))

fido101

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Joined: 2/26/2010

 

Posted: 6:03:23 PM 2/26/2010

I disagree with such aggressive breeding practices on dogs, I think it's inhumane and cruel. They are not wolves that have an average life span of four to five years and only come into heat once a year.

What about the overall health of the dog mentally. I have witnessed many dogs after birthing so exhausted and thin they look like death. This shows to me it's much more than talking about what a missed heat can do to them inside what about their overall health? Raising a litter is very draining and I was told by a well respected vet it is proven to lower their overall health and quality of puppies, plus life span from such breeding practices.

Dogs are human made and basing a study on wolves for dogs is wrong. I think this is another way to try and Okay mass producing puppies with out having breeders feel quilty about it.

We adopted a dog from a breeder which had five litters by 4 and a half years old. She passed her vet check up and went in for surgery to be spayed. The vet was horrified to what he saw inside her. Her horns were almost hanging out and distroyed from breeding. They were so stretched and torn that he could almost poke his fingers right threw the tissue. Her heart rate dropped and she almost died in surgery due to her inside health from over breeding.
Her first four litters were large and healthy. Then the fourth litter resulted in three puppies two died. The breeder no longer felt she was breeding quality and on she went.
I have heard of dogs bleeding to death, puppies dyeing and dogs so exhausted they just lay down on their puppies and smuther them.
I believe this is another form of a puppy mills. No matter how you look at it this is not for the dogs but to mass produce puppies and breeders to gain. Pure slavery, I only wish their was a law to how often a dog can be bred!

Dog breeding is a billion dollar industry and needs to be regulated. You should have to fill out a form and be approved for breeding or get a fine if you breed with out your paper work. In germany this is how it is done.
Time US and Canada get up to standards.

fido101

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Joined: 2/26/2010

 

Posted: 6:05:41 PM 2/26/2010

I do agree that if a dog can handle it two litters in a row is fine but needs to be approved first by the vets. Doing two litters a year for five to six years is an average practice for Australian Labradoodle ILA members. That's Twelve litters in a row is INSANE!!! and Wrong!! In my opinion.

I do believe this is an area that needs to be regulated and is out of control.

How would you like to be bred every single year through your 20's to 30's.
Why wouldn't you want this? Manybe ask yourself how your dog might feel.

DeputyDog

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Posts: 254

Joined: 3/13/2007

Posted: 7:41:57 PM 2/26/2010

QUOTE BY FIDO 101 "Dog breeding is a billion dollar industry and needs to be regulated. You should have to fill out a form and be approved for breeding or get a fine if you breed with out your paper work. In germany this is how it is done.
Time US and Canada get up to standards."

That's a fine idea. Let's get another government bureaucracy with no knowledge of the industry to "regulate" us and then tell those of us that do devote time and energy in the production, promotion and preservation of canines how we should best do our jobs. Yes, good idea, lets all fill out those forms. Perhaps we can include that information in the census.

You realize you are suggesting that the same government that can't even procure or manage delivery of H1N1 vaccines for the general populous this winter in a timely manner also tell those of us that KNOW what we are doing how they think we can do it better. You are advocating that the same Federal Bureaucracy that has no plan to insure that Social Security will remain solvent into the next decade also oversee canine reproduction. Yeah, OK Government has the answer.

Tell ya what Fido, If you are so fond of German regulation, what the hell are you doing here?You can't win if you don't play the game -- Me!

All cruelty stems from weakness -- Seneca

Sometimes a dog is as good as any man -- Bell/Houser

judy12

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Joined: 5/28/2010

 

Posted: 6:09:36 PM 5/28/2010

Did this study also study those dogs that must have c-sections to deliver each litter?

breezeyridge

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Posts: 64

Joined: 1/3/2009

 

Posted: 6:50:45 PM 5/28/2010

I do not think a once in a while back to back would be bad, but not on every litter. PLUS these vets that are NOW saying this are also PROMOTING c-sections that are NOT needed, they say it is easier and faster for everyone involved, breeder and mother!!! And they ALSO say C-section EVERY TIME!!!! NOW think about that!! Where is that money going....right into their pocket!!!

I think it is TOTALLY a case by case issue, My dog had 12 pups that is 2 litters right there!!!! I am sorry but after that she deserves a break!

Not all breeders or people agree with back to back breedings this is a personal choice. Linda is well educated over this matter and would not breed her dogs in any manner that would not be vet approved or safe to the dogs.

This is a personal question as to how many times can you breed a dog? Each dog is an individual on how they handle birthing and raising young. It would be based and evaluated individually by an experience breeder and vet.

To clarify; Linda's extended family does have dogs and it could appear that they might be hers but in fact I now understand they are not a part of Copper Canyon Labradoodles. Linda often will help her family if needed.

Goldendoodle.com has never kicked a breeder off the site they would address any complaints if one was to arise. Linda never had any complaints while a listed breeder, Linda chose not to relist but focus on the ILAA club instead. 

What is an Australian Labradoodle? Best to read the lists provided on ILAA as too many versions of what a labradoodle is are all over the internet

Labradoodles are a cross bred dog and pure Australian or mixed Australian labradoodles they are all labradoodles and come from mix background.  The ILAA has a list of different versions of labradoodles, it comes down to they are all crossbred dogs from two up to five different breeds in their heritage.

Facts Linda has never bred a dog 8 times, it was a misunderstanding over this one Special

People can have questions as to what is considered a small breeder or large breeder? Home or kennel raised.

Linda has a well organized family home with clean birthing areas right in her kitchen, living room and backroom off the kitchen.  Her puppies are well socialized and played with each day and this living arrangement would only be done by a dedicated and devoted breeder to the proper up bring that is required for early development and good health.

Towards the electric fence it was placed around one pen area for the adult dogs safety.  In good weather the puppies when old enough enjoy playtime in two turn out pens located at the side of the house . Linda does not have a fence yard and all her dogs go for several walks each day. Many pets don't get this kind of exercise. Any dogs living with Linda are well cared for and loved and it is clear to see this with a visit. They are always well groomed, clean and feed top quality food. They are all UTD on all health check ups health testing, training and are infact all loved family members that are apart of the family.

We would like to apologize for any misunderstanding over the reports filed about copper canyon labradoodle and owner Linda. I posted the comments after dealing with some false postings about ourselves which resulted in frustrations that ended up over flowing on Linda. In no way do we feel she is a puppy mill or a irresponsible breeder and in fact have purchased several dogs from her as we felt she was an excellent trustworthy and devoted caring breeder. This matter has been addressed and dealt with between the two parties and been resolved.  

Linda owner of Copper Canyon Labradoodles and  De medici poodles is a recommended dog breeder. (Not all breeders or people agree with how often some of her dogs are bred but do believe she would never intentionally do anything to harm her dogs as they are in fact loved family members)

Is it humane to breed a dog so many times? Is it abuse? Are their laws to protect dogs from breeders? (This is a question I have about dog breeders in general, how many times is it safe to breed a dog and when is it considered not safe?, this is not an attack against Linda personally but my own questions for all breeders all over the world)

(Facts Linda has never bred a dog 8 times but a dog owned by her has been bred this many times, and this is what was posted to ask at what point do you or should you retire a dog, what is safe? When or is it ever considered abuse?)


Why does this breeder need to sell puppies under different names, family members, but not on her web site? What is she trying to hide?  (It is a family run business that her mom, sister and daughter all take part in and different names apply to different breeding programs, Linda does not hide anything but clearly shows her breeding history on both her web sites)

 Would she be kicked off Australian Labradoodle Assoc. breeders list if she was caught breeding dogs like she is? (We do not know if this could happened or what the site supports for how many times a dog can be bred) I know she is a member of the ILAA in good standings and they wouldn't let her be a listed breeder if they had any questions they are very good at enforcing good conduct for each one of their breeders.

I wonder if it has to do with her false ads claiming she is only a small breeder with only house raised dogs but in fact she is a large kennel, with kennel raised puppies!!
(What is considered a small breeder 5 dogs or 10? Her dogs are house raised and she does have a kennel if needed, are they then considered house raised or kennel dogs are they have seen both) Puppies are always raised in her home and not in a kennel, they will only go out to the kennel once they are older and need more room to run etc. I would consider these house raised dogs.

"FAKE Australian Labradoodles" Australian Labradoodles that are not even purebred but poodle and cockapoo crosses. (Labradoodles are a cross bred dog and pure Australian or mixed australian they are all labradoodles and come from mix background, the ILAA has a list of 10 different versions of labradoodles, it comes down to they are all crossbred dogs from 2 up to 5 different breeds)

It is hard for many breeders to justifies one selling their labradoodles for $3000 when they sell their own puppies for an average of $1000 each.  When breeders put the same amount of work into their breeding programs,  health testing and often sharing the same bloodlines can leave one to question if this is right?  

Many claim that all dog breeders breed for money or they wouldn't breed at all.  If you didn't cover your expenses no one could afford to house and breed dogs as you see today. Linda breeds for a living and has a family to raise and is why she breeds her dogs more often. She works very hard to produce top quality dogs that are healthy and mentally sound. She has excellent foundation dogs from Australia which has been mixed with early generation and cockapoo's to make sure her dogs are healthy and not inbred. She mixes in new bloodlines as the Australian gene pool was getting inbred as a responsible breeder she has infused new bloodlines to make sure her dogs are healthy.  

How does a breeder have so many litters in the house as they claim? Easy they are well planned out and raised in many rooms, which only a devoted dog breeder would want in their family home.

How can these puppies and adults get enough care! They do not have a fenced yard and these dogs are walked for potty breaks several times a day. Most pets don't even get daily walks, they are in easy to care for clips or the dogs live in guardian homes not all at Linda's house.

Yes her sister and mother next door also share Linda interest for breeding labradoodles and have dogs are their house. 

For dogs protection they have or used to have had a hot wire around some pens. These pens back onto the forest, I do not know if any puppies have ever been in these kennel runs while the fence was one. It was wrong to suggest that they were getting shocked as only Linda can answer this

I have never personally heard of an aggressive dogs but did know Linda had to take a dog back from Calgary due as the labradoodle growl at the husband and it only got worse. I know Linda flew to Calgary to help the family train the dog but in the end she took him home.  I myself as a breeder has seen this were some dogs just don't like men.

I have seen a few shy puppies but this is normal puppy development. It is called early fear phase that is between 8 to 12 weeks of age and second fear phase is at 7 to 9 months old. Puppies can also be unsure of them of life changes when hormones start around 4 to 7 months old. Never mind stress with house training etc.  As puppies can have such a wide range or training during their development  no breed of dog can be said to be all the same each breed and each individual puppy will have it's own personality.

These are Linda's breeding history that she is not a shamed to post.

  Previous Litters Archive Bobbi's Nov 2009 Litter    Grace's May 2010 Litter   Lucy's Summer 2008 Litter   Lucy's Summer 2009 Litter Bobbi's Jan 2009 Litter   Bobbi's Summer 2008 Litter   Cassie's Summer 2006 Litter   Cassie's Winter 2006 Litter   Cassie's Summer 2007 Litter Cassie's Summer 2008 Litter   Cassie's Summer 2009 Litter   Dancer's Spring 2006 Litter   Dancer's Spring 2007 Litter   Dancer's Winter 2007 Litter Dancer's Summer 2009 Litter   Mia's Winter 2008 Litter   Missy's Winter 2009 Litter   Muggles' Spring 2009 Litter   Muggles Winter 2009 Litter   Nicky's Summer 2008 Litter   Nicky's Spring 2010 Litter   Special's Summer 2006Litter   Special's Spring 2007 Litter   Special's Winter 2007 Litter   Special's Fall 2008 Litter Fancy's Summer 2007 Litte r New litters: Copper Canyon Lady  and Sunsethills Fergus, Copper Canyon Shiraz and Alpenridge Sunset Trails, Greene's Missy and Hat Trick (Charlie) , Copper Canyon Sweet Georgia Brown & Alpenridge Sunset Trails , Sharon's Bobbi Bear and Sunsethills Fergus LABRADOODLE PUPPIES (med size)


This is one of Linda's old dogs now owned by her sister:

Price $1300 Six beautiful puppies were born in December and will be eight weeks old and ready to go to homes February 10th. There are two males and four females, with two females and one male spoken for. The mother, Special, is a calm, loving, mild natured family dog. She is a lovely cream color and on the small side of medium. The father is a chocolate labradoodle, medium size, a fun, sweet boy. Both parents are multi-generation labradoodles, and non-shedding so we know their puppies will be non-shedding also. Our puppies are raised in our home, and with our two children, so are well adjusted to children and normal household noises. The puppies will be about 17"-19" tall. Our puppies are also litterbox trained. The puppies come with their spay/neuter, first shots, health check, are wormed and well loved! To approved homes only.    Outside Nanaimo Ad Id: 11010944 This item is new Date: Sun, 22 Aug 2010 12:35:34 -0700 From: [email protected] Subject: Re: UsedVictoria.com: Buyers Question - ADORABLE LABRADOODLE PUPPIES Hi there, Was the breeder in Chemainus Copper Canyon Labradoodles?  If so... my female was used by them before, her name is Special.  The father is a miniature chocolate poodle from their poodle program, his name is Lenny.  The owner of Copper Canyon Labradoodles is actually my sister.  These pups are a cross between a purebred multi-gen australian labradoodle and a purebred miniature poodle... not registered or papered, but from fully health tested parents, and at a lower price because of these factors. Hopefully this answers your question.  If you have other questions or would like to come meet our puppies, feel free to contact me either by email or phone:  250 246-9780(h) 250 210-3735(c). Thank you, Karen. More of Linda's litters Many of her breedings are even listed Several dogs and their litters are no longer listed on both sites   Aurora's Winter 2009 Litter Aurora's 2008 Litter Ellie's Winter 2008 Litter Ellie's Summer 2009 Litter Jill's Winter 2007 Litter Jill's Summer 2009 Litter Jills (not listed) Auroras (not listed) Fancy's litters (not listed) Ellie winter 2009 (not listed)   Aurora's Miniature Poodle Litter   Due September 2010 Ellie's  Moyen Poodle Litter   Winter 2010

Other vancouver island breeders are

urban golden doodles, shadymaple doodles, coppercanyone labradoodles, highbrook labradoodles, labradoodle passion, sslabradoodles, stirlinglabradoodles, karenslabradoodles,cobbliehill labradoodles, johnsgoldendoodles, snowywhitegoldendoodles, cream of the crop goldendoodles, fosgatefurbabies
Many other doodle breeders advertise on Kijiji or usedvictoria

My name is Linda Gelaude and as much as I dislike these types of sites, I feel compelled to address this issue at this time.  NO proof is required in order to file a ripoff report and it seems anybody can anonymously slander a person or business on this site.  In effect, one is now guilty until proven innocent and ripoffreport.com is willing to 'help' one prove one's innocence...  for a fee, of course. 

I'm hoping that my rebuttal is posted verbatim since I'd be cross if my posting was edited in any way by ripoffreport.com and have emailed myself a copy of my rebuttal for comparison.

For the record, I have never bred any of our girls eight times, nor will I.  Our dogs are not bred every heat cycle as claimed.  The dog referred to by Ange is Special, who was purchased from Tegan Park in 2006.  Special was bred four times while a part of my breeding program and those litters are posted on our previous litters archive.  Special is a well loved family pet who sleeps indoors, often on the couch, and is very well cared for. 

Our breeding dogs do live in our home with us or in carefully chosen guardian homes so that our dogs are NOT in a kennel type situation and our puppies are indeed raised in our home.  Usually the puppies are in our kitchen but occasionally are in the back entry room/laundry room when they get older and are using a litter box (not my favorite scent for my kitchen...)  Our puppies are not timid, they are handled daily and played with by my children. 

We were not "kicked off" the goldendoodles.com website, we chose to not renew our annual subscription to their service but we do respect their service, still meet their requirements in order to be listed on their site and I'm quite sure that they would confirm this if somebody contacted them regarding this matter.  But as I said, proof is not required in order for somebody to post one of these ripoff reports.

This whole posting was done as a misguided attempt by another local breeder to try and clear her own name by putting my name in the mud.  Considerable text in this ripoff report is directly copied from her posting there.  Here is the link to that issue.  http://www.ripoffreport.com/animal-services/bc-doodles-labradood/buyer-beware-bc-doodles-la-9c879.htm  Considering that she and this man were in a court battle against each other, it's pretty hard to believe that this man had myself and this woman confused...  And since he's subsequently had a heart attack and has passed away, he can hardly refute this claim by this breeder.

I personally know the person who made this ripoff report and do not have interest in entering into some sort of mud-slinging contest with her or anybody.  I have personally spoken with this person tonight and have requested that she come forward and clean up this mess by publicly apologizing on this ripoff site and agreeing that she will not conduct herself in this way again.  I sincerely hope that she has the integrity and courage to do so.  Perhaps then we could leave this behind us and move forward...

I am disinclined to post/repost/rebut on this forum, so if people wish to comment, ask questions, etc, you are welcome to contact me personally by email or via phone.  All that information is on our website as well as listed at the top of this page.  If you phone, please do so between the hours of 10am - 5pm Pacific Daylight Time.  If you live within driving distance you are welcome to come, meet us and our crew here and see how we raise our dogs.  We do ask that you call ahead so we're home rather than out doing errands and that you give the bottoms of shoes a wipe with a bleach rag BEFORE you get out of the car to minimize the risk of parvo coming to the property.

Regards, Linda Gelaude

I have purchased several dogs over the years from Linda that were very nice dogs. One poodle had a bladder infection which our vet said is comman with a puppy that has an inverted vulva. After three weeks of meds it all cleared up wasn't an issue at all. I have had a couple timid puppies from her and a friend but this is expected when multiple litters are raised at once and you take this puppy out of it's regular routine and bring it into a busy home.

I would not have purchased dogs from her if I felt she was abusing her dogs in anyway. We are a vet recommended breeder that fully health tests our dogs and I would not hesitate to buy a puppy Linda from Chemainus BC.

She knows her breed of dog very well and I do not believe she would be breeding her dogs 8 times if she did not have medical data to back up why she feels it's safe to do this. I myself wouldn't breed my dogs this many times but it's because I'm not comfortable doing it. I'm not comfortable doing early spay and neuter as well but I don't disagree with it.  

I'm sure that Linda has good reason for breeding like this or allowing her sister to breed her retired dogs with one of her stud dogs. 

I have told linda that in the wild natural dogs breed every heat and its normal but the twist is they only live to around 4 years of age.  

If you have any doubts as to the health of her dogs or how often she breeds then talk to her.

Request a tour, ask if she has had any problems from breeding like his, dogs or puppies dieing?.

Ask if any dogs have been retured for health reasons or problems with their dispositions?

As she has been breeding for quite sometime I'm sure she hasn't been able to please 100% of buyers or people she has talked to but in my experience I would not hesitate to recommend her or her dogs as good family pets.

Special was indeed a special much loved dog and it angers me the greed people have to breed and breed, I always stated that if you could not progress with the genetics of a dog after 2-3 litters then your breeding program is questionable. To breed litter after litter often to the same sire is puppy milling, they get away with it by masking as small dedicated breeders but to me they are nothing more than mass producers. Unfortunately I have to stand by helplessly, there is nothing I can do to force people to be respectful and kind to their dogs. Contracts and agreements are nothing more than pieces of paper without huge amounts of money to take people to court to enforce an agreement is prohibitive so beautiful dogs who I believed were going to genuine breeders to help better the breed sometimes turn out to be something entirely different but with out a crystal ball telling me the future I have no power to protect my beautiful dogs. Special does not deserve to be used and abused nor does any dog but how do we control their welfare. I know there are others not just little Special suffering this greed.

If there is anything I can do to help support you to help these dogs I would like to do whatever I can.

Not sure if I should say thanks for letting me know as it is very upsetting to say the least

Ange