Complaint Review: HSBC Household Finance Beneficial Mortgage - Hillsborough New Hampshire

Did you let the 1st lender know that you were not occupying the house that could have been against the loan agreement. No matter how much you might feel that you were swindled, everything about your loan was in black and white on the loan documents, did you bother to read them? I worked for HSBC in their credit card division and over 90% of the people DO NOT read their cardmember agreement but yet they still complain that they were ripped off when they are billed fees. No one twists your arm to take a credit card or a loan if you don't like the terms in a contract DON'T SIGN THE PAPERS!!!! Buyer Beware. I wish the American public would start taking responsibility for their actions and stop blaming others or suing others for their stupidity.

I've worked for Beneficial for 5 years, I sold a lot of mortgages in my time. I do not ever remember twisting someone's arm to sign our loan documents. In fact, its the exact opposite: when customers clearly seem upset about the terms, I always asked them to please not sign because we work locally in the branches and the last thing I need is someone standing at my desk flipping out because they can't afford the payment. There are strict policies and guidelines in regards to debt to income ratio, it is well documented and they must be able to afford the payments or else they do not qualify. Her 2nd mortgage was probably sold to HSBC. It was originated with a broker and then they sell it right away. I know for a fact they do not use brokers. I've always noticed that people are happy and fine and dandy signing away on something and spending the money they received from a refinance, then are real quick to blame us when they can't afford the payment. I had a customer tell me, you guys are hurting me with the second mortgage we have. I asked how is that hurting you? They said, "because it's at 14percent." Okay, did they not know this when they signed the loan? I know they did because we have a third party close the loans. I also noticed they had twenty thousand dollars handed to them from this second mortgage. What did you do with this money? I see that we were saving you over 600 dollars at the time and you paid off a lot of bills, that didn't help you? People forget real quickly. Especially this family. They were saved from the worst type of mortgage out there. The adjustable. Beneficial should have just let her sink. Where would she be now?

I disagree that HHF do not use brokers because I went through a broker to get my loan with HHF.

To Lfamily: You did not give a date for your refinance with HSBC but if it was later than Oct 2002 it appears you were subjected to another case of HSBC ignoreing the terms of thier settlement with the 50 Attorneys General. I will not get into details here but it appears your loans (not only the refinance but the initial 20% for 1st mortgage) do not adhere to guidelines agreed to in that settlement. RE: HSBC/HFC/Beneficial agreed to not write refinance or customer solicited mortgages that did not result in a true savings to the customer with no hardship. Also not to right secondary loans to cover % downpayments. For more info search for-HFC/Beneficial 2002 settlement- in your bowser search engine and go to link for your states Attorney-Generals office. Note Virginia AG website has the settlement posted verbatim. To Bill: It appears if you are a credit counsler you need a new career for you seem very badly informed on HSBC et al. They do not use mortgage brokers, all mortgages are branch generated. Mostly by direct mailings and existing customer solicitation.

it was your choice to take an adjustable rate mortgage instead of a fixed rate..... between the katrina winers and the arm borrowers that are looking for handouts and bailouts i can see why our economy is the way it is take resposibility for your choice and pay your mortgage... and why would you have a new baby if you were having these financial issues and worried about your payments going up. this is not a rip off.

it was your choice to take an adjustable rate mortgage instead of a fixed rate..... between the katrina winers and the arm borrowers that are looking for handouts and bailouts i can see why our economy is the way it is take resposibility for your choice and pay your mortgage... and why would you have a new baby if you were having these financial issues and worried about your payments going up. this is not a rip off.

it was your choice to take an adjustable rate mortgage instead of a fixed rate..... between the katrina winers and the arm borrowers that are looking for handouts and bailouts i can see why our economy is the way it is take resposibility for your choice and pay your mortgage... and why would you have a new baby if you were having these financial issues and worried about your payments going up. this is not a rip off.

Well like LFamily I was a victim of the creative mortgage finance world, and I too managed to find another family to rent my home before I lost it! This of course, meant I also had to find another home to relocate to; one I could afford! And while I didn't have a large family like LFamily must have, I wanted to at least try to keep a roof over my family's head too! So does this make me and all other families facing a foreclosure criminals if they find people to rent their home of future doom? Or how about when seeking another lender for a home they can afford? I don't think so! In fact, it can only help the consumer with protecting their credit if renting out the property; keeping it from being destroyed! Having a Tenant occupy the home also boosts the Consumers income when they go up for consideration of another more suitable loan. And I have seen no law stating it was a crime in saving ones own bottom in this way! So, in respect to LFamily and other Consumers seeking a way out their pending doom; there is no relevance in Bill's Rebuttals, or professional opinion for that matter! What I see Bill has done is merely accuse before hearing all facts, and then continue to harass LFamily; who obviously made the mistake of gloating about having a home they could keep in the end. As a person who had to go this route to keep one roof verses the other; I understand what happened to their family! While it's unfortunate that their Tenants didn't work out, it's good they still have a home they can keep legally. Perhaps other families in the same boat will do the same thing to save a roof over their family's heads too! I am not suggesting a family take on another loan with another banking institution, it is entirely up to that family; if they want to remain Home Owners! But they could also rent elsewhere, while renting out their property to another family who would keep with the mortgage payments! Best Wishes! Kandace in Florida

Bill you are clearly very confused! It is not an act of fraud if I DID NOT Know that the Tenants Renting my property (facing the potential for Foreclosure today) we're not planning to stay! I am not one to perdict the future! So how again did I brake the law? Why are you so angry with me? Is it for my lack of care that I can't afford a mortgage I was taken for initially, and because I am grateful to have a roof over my head that I can keep? Gesh, for a Credit counselor or other, you don't appear to be very professional to me, aside from uneducated yourself! If you were, you would have known in the beginning of story there was no fraud involved in 1. aquiring a second home with the bank noting the debt of the other home and 2. the Tenants who moved in to pay the HSBC mortgage. So again where's the fraud? I really was tempted not to reply to your message, but because of the nature of your threats and the ongoing harassment, in addition to your swearing at me (violations of RIPoffs Terms of use) I am only going to say this once, please refrain from contacting me again via this thread, and I do plan to contact the owner of this Webmaster regarding your rebuttals. THANK YOU!

ITS NO ONES BUSINESS BUT YOURS SO IM NOT SURE WHY YOU POSTED THIS IF NOT FOR SOMEONE TO SEE IT...DUH. IM NOT A REALTOR, I AM A CREDIT COUNSELOR, SO I HAVE A LOT OF CLIENTS THAT ARE FACING FORCLOSURE. NOW TRY TO FOLLOW BECAUSE YOU ARE HAVING A LOT OF TROUBLE DOING SO. WHAT I SAID WAS IF YOU GOT A LOAN FROM THE GOVERNMENT KNOWING YOU WERE GOING TO LET GO OF THE 1 HOUSE IMMEDIATELY AFTERWARD, THAT IS FRAUD. THAT WOULD BE STEALING MONEY FROM THE TAX PAYERS! I WAS TRYING TO HELP YOU MAKE SURE THAT YOU WERENT "TRICKED" FOR THE MILLIONTH TIME. YOU SEEM TO LAY ALL THE BLAME FOR YOUR MISTAKES AS BEING TRICKED. I HOPE THEY DO COME AFTER YOU NOW, CUSE THE LAST COUPLE OF POSTS SHOW JUST HOW UNEDUCATED & DEVIOUS YOU ARE! THERE IS NO DOUBT IN MY MIND NOW THAT YOU WILLINGLY DEFRAUDED THE FHA. CARMA IS A FUNNY THING, IT HAS A WAY OF BITING SCUMBAGS IN THE END! GOOD LUCK WHEN THE FBI OR TREASURY AGENTS COME TO YOUR DOOR. BUT OF COURSE, AS YOUR NATURE SUGGESTS, YOU WILL BLAME IT ON BEING TRICKED. GROW THE HELL UP!

Bill once again! There was no action of fraud to acquire my second home weather on FHA or through any other mortgage company for that matter! As I said to clarify "your" confusion (via my re post), the bank knew of the home we are "about to" face foreclosure on and included that information on the debt of the home in my closing home mortgage documents for the new house; so therefore I hardly see your point in your effort to accuse me of committing a crime or otherwise! We "were" in good standing with HSBC before the default began to happen. And as I said in my first post, we "had" Tenants renting the property when we left, who then bowed out on us, so again, having the bank see documents on these Tenants and proof of the income at the time, how is this fraud? You are apparently reaching for an issue that "I" did something wrong with the banks here, and even though it "wasn't" a crime to acquire my second home in the way that we did (by having the first home rented), you are right about one thing, that I was "stupid" enough to fall for HSBCs song and dance to take on their refinance loan against the house we obviously couldn't afford (even though they said we could rewrite the loan in 3 months), and that is why we let Tenants move in! AGAIN, we merely took their loan to "save a roof" over our family's heads, and there was no crime or skeam involved in what we did, it was very legal! If anything it was a hard lesson learned. But, again I don't care that the house is going to be foreclosed upon now, not because we lost Tenants and the income to pay back the loan, but simply because we were taken for a ride by HSBCs lending department! Yes, the home is due to be foreclosed upon because again, we can't afford it! We are also back months in the payments due to the loss in income. And where the housing market is flooded with foreclosures due to these song and dance type of loans and sub-prime lending, (which we originally had with the adjustable rate / remember?) then it makes things difficult to sell, and for us it was too late! Fortunately it was clever thinking to get out while we could, having the Tenants to pay the mortgage to HSBC, therefore it was "then" worth a try to save the home, but it isn't anymore, when there is no income to back it up! Tell me Bill, you say you have clients, so I am assuming you are a Realtor or involved in some aspect of the Real Estate business; but if you are trying to make a sale for yourself, and I know that the Realtors are solely paid a commission, so are you always this judgmental and rude to your Clients? If so, that's too bad for them, or perhaps yourself! And for the record, as I said I was very young coming out of my first marriage. My ex destoryed my credit when he stoled from me and filed claims for his own issues billing them under my name. He was also a drug addict, so you see why I did divorce him, but by the time I pleaded my case against him, it was too late for me then too! However, none of that is really any of your business. And for my "story" nothing has changed, but rather I went further into detail to better explained what happened to us, and to defend our stand from your barbaric allegations! I am sorry to confuse you or to let you down. This will be last post to your messages now, as you have aided in addition to my burden. Thank You

IN YOUR 1ST POST YOU SAID " Well, I can tell you this much; I may have a foreclosure on my hands with HSBC, but I also have a Lawyer to file for Bankruptcy so I owe them nothing, and a new home I still have, protected by FHA!" GIVING THE IMPRESSION THAT YOU ALLOWED A PROPERTY TO GO INTO FORCLOSURE WHILE AT THE SAME TIME OBTAINING A GOVERNMENT GUARANTEED LOAN TO REPLACE IT..THAT WOULD BE BANK FRAUD AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT! YOUR SECOND POST YOU SAID "And if foreclosure ever comes my way with the previous house they're expecting payment for, oh well!" WHICH GIVES THE IMPRESSION THAT ITS NOT YET IN FORCLOSURE WHICH WOULD NOT BE BANK FRAUD AGAINST THE GOVERNMENT. BY THE WAY, YOUR RIGHT I NEVER LOST MY HOME OR HAD BAD CREDIT BECAUSE OF DIVORCE. NOW WHAT DOES DIVORCE HAVE TO DO WITH BAD CREDIT? I GOT DIVORCED ONCE & IT DIDNT CHANGE A THING ABOUT THE WAY I PAID MY BILLS!

Well apparently due to your allegations I had to find myself updating my report to clarify my discussion! There was no fraud commited here! My Realtor friend was not a working Realtor on the books and only offered suggestions on how to save my family from being homeless with two infants and a disabled child. She hadn't even helped find our home or was she apart of the closing! And the bank who closed us on the new house, knew about the home elsewhere, including that we had it as a debt! So again, there was nothing done illegal here! Have you ever lost your home? I doubt it! And personally I don't care, as you can plainly see, wether HSBC was a broker or a corporate bank! They still yes "lied" to us! The officer tricked us in effort to seal the deal, like they do to a lot of consumers these days! And for this issue amoungst most families, why do you see so many homes being foreclosed upon? And several banks closing their doors, or going bankrupt themselves? As I said earlier, it's simple CORPORATE GREED!! You are going to see and hear about several million other homes being foreclosed upon this year because of it!

Like many US citizens I was a new Buyer with shady credit after a young marriage that ended in divorce. But having children to raise, I still wanted to achieve the dream of owning my first home, not renting an apartment the rest of my life! I tried for three years, never giving up! I remarried during that time, and my new husband also had a child from a previous marriage, who is disabled. Fortunately my endless effort to purchase a home was a success! We were so excited about the prospect of being new home owners, even if the property was an older home! However after a year of residing there, this excitement began to diminish! Why? Well, it's simple, although we achieved our dream of home ownership, given my past credit on record at the time of acquiring the home; we obtained an 80/20 loan, or in laments terms: %100 financing with an Adjustable interest rate mortgage "teaser loan". It was at that time we were told we could rid it by refinancing and locking in at a decent rate following a year of our timely payments! Well, this was a far-fetched shattered hope, as when I tried to go up to the banks (via Lending Tree.com) most turned me down, in spite of the on-time payments I had made, and others told me I should wait another year, and so I did! I tried again, dreading the upcoming Adjustable mortgage climb, and again ran into the same situation happened! What was I doing wrong? I didn't do anything to further damage my credit, and made my payments each month, so what gives? There were few lenders who wanted to refinance me, but weren't offering a fair interest rate! I was running out of options and was afraid I'd be losing my home some time in the near future if I couldn't get a fair deal! And so HSBC (whom we were already a customer with for the %20 portion of loan), offered to refinance me with additional money to cash us out with, should we need the extra money to catch up on bills! However, prior to this occurring, the Adjustable portion of the loans had indeed taken affect, and was set again to do so periodically for 6 months until it reached the exausted maximum interest rate allowed! Gasping, we accepted their refinance with HSBC, although it wasn't any better! But, we were also told by the Lending Officer we signed with, that we could revisit the loan and refinance in the next 3 months to lower the payment down. I believed him, and so when I called him to set us up an appt. to come in and do so, he told me differently than he had at the closing table, and that he could not lower the payment! Therefor, the additional money they gave us to cash out with, we paid back to them to pay the mortgage payments we were beginning to have a hard time with! As although they saved us from an adjustable rate climb in the future with our previous loan, their deal wasn't any better! and in fact it was $600 more than we had been paying, although facing further hike! HSBC undoubtedly took us for a ride! So much for our credit and all of the timely payments we had made over the course of two years huh? It's exactly how I felt! Corprate greed is what has been happening to many other families like me! And so I really started to feel helpless, worried about the thought of losing my home was drawing closer. I called HSBCs hardship department and they would not help us in spite of the information we offered them to catch a brake! It was because of the money we cashed out with at the closing table, and even though we spent it by giving it back to them, they still turned us down! I was running out of options! I sat and did hours of research and finally sought help from an old friend of mine, who knows a few things about Real Estate, even though she wasn't an agent. She suggested it may be time to consider letting someone else try to save the mortgage, like a Tenant to rent the place. I was still very admament about being a home owner though, and so she suggested a gal who did FHA (more secure loans). It was like taking on a second home, but instead using it as your primary residence. So in last ditch effort we went for it! We found someone to lease option the house, and with FHA aware of who was taking the home up there, while we moved into the new house, we closed the deal! My friend (with her knowledge and assistance) helped save my family from being homeless! As for HSBC, should the Tenant leave, I will not need to worry about being homeless locked in at a fair %7 rate! A rate in which I have deserved for a long time! And if foreclosure ever comes my way with the previous house they're expecting payment for, oh well! It is furthest from my concern, since I clearly a have a roof over my family's heads either way! I am grateful for the home I aquired and the receiving a rate I can actually afford!

BUT THIS SOUNDS LIKE BANK FRAUD. YOU MAY WANT TO CONSULT AN ATTORNEY TO SEE IF YOU CAN BE CHARGED WITH A CRIME! BY ANY CHANCE WAS THE "Realtor friend" THE ONE THAT SOLD YOU THE NEW HOUSE? ALSO, I THINK THAT HSBC USES INDEPENDENT BROKERS, IF SO THEY WERENT THE ONES THAT LIED TO YOU, NOT THE BANK. IF IT WAS THE BANK, WHY DIDNT YOU GET IT IN WRITING? BUT I REALLY WOULD SEEK ADVICE FROM AN ATTORNEY THOUGH CAUSE IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU WERE LIED TO AGAIN, THIS TIME BY YOUR "Realtor friend", AS I HAVE SEVERAL CLIENTS THAT ARE IN THE SAME BOAT THAT YOU WERE IN & THE ONLY "stepping in to help" THE GOVERNMENT HAS DONE IS TO SET UP A PROGRAM FOR THOSE WHO QUALIFY, TO FREZE THE TEASER RATE FOR 3YRS & EVEN THAT WAS DONE WITH THE COOPERATION OF THE OF THE BANKS! IF YOUR "Realtor friend" DID LIE TO YOU & TRICK YOU INTO COMMITTING A CRIME, ITS NOT TO LATE TO DEAL WITH IT. WHAT YOU HAVE TO REALIZE ABOUT THE "MORTGAGE CRUNCH" IS THAT MOST OF THE BLAME THAT DOESNT LIE WITH CONSUMERS THAT MAKE POOR CHOICES, LIES WITH THE BROKERS & REAL ESTATE AGENTS THAT DID WHATEVER NECESSARY TO PUT THE DEALS THROUGH.