Complaint Review: Pro Gas & Heating - Surrey British Columbia

I would love to take Mr. Lowe to court but the cost in time and money just doesn't make sense. I don't believe there is much chance of collecting any money from Mr. Lowe even after winning in court. If you are considering doing business with Pro Gas & Heating read all of the complaints against this company first. There are so many other companies in the Surrey area that have good reputations I see no reason to take a chance with Mr. Lowe.

Michael.... Rely.... your complaint has no merit and if you think it does, do something about it apart from trying to sling mud. If you feel you have a case and this company has ripped you off, take action and I'll see you in court. The police have investigated your complaint and found it has NO foundation and this company and I broke NO laws. The legally binding contract we have is very clear and you defaulted. Why don't we talk about that instead! You have been offered resolution but have not partaken. Apparently it's easier for you to sit at your computer and demerit this company and myself rather than take the high road and stand up for your position and principles in a court of law. Put your money where your mouth is as I have, or be silent! Ed

Michael.... Rely.... your complaint has no merit and if you think it does, do something about it apart from trying to sling mud. If you feel you have a case and this company has ripped you off, take action and I'll see you in court. The police have investigated your complaint and found it has NO foundation and this company and I broke NO laws. The legally binding contract we have is very clear and you defaulted. Why don't we talk about that instead! You have been offered resolution but have not partaken. Apparently it's easier for you to sit at your computer and demerit this company and myself rather than take the high road and stand up for your position and principles in a court of law. Put your money where your mouth is as I have, or be silent! Ed

Michael.... Rely.... your complaint has no merit and if you think it does, do something about it apart from trying to sling mud. If you feel you have a case and this company has ripped you off, take action and I'll see you in court. The police have investigated your complaint and found it has NO foundation and this company and I broke NO laws. The legally binding contract we have is very clear and you defaulted. Why don't we talk about that instead! You have been offered resolution but have not partaken. Apparently it's easier for you to sit at your computer and demerit this company and myself rather than take the high road and stand up for your position and principles in a court of law. Put your money where your mouth is as I have, or be silent! Ed

Michael.... Rely.... your complaint has no merit and if you think it does, do something about it apart from trying to sling mud. If you feel you have a case and this company has ripped you off, take action and I'll see you in court. The police have investigated your complaint and found it has NO foundation and this company and I broke NO laws. The legally binding contract we have is very clear and you defaulted. Why don't we talk about that instead! You have been offered resolution but have not partaken. Apparently it's easier for you to sit at your computer and demerit this company and myself rather than take the high road and stand up for your position and principles in a court of law. Put your money where your mouth is as I have, or be silent! Ed

You can view other Ropoff Reports about this company by searching the following report numbers: 360259 343023 369393 344748 The BBB has fixed their Web site so an on-line search now brings up the complaints. If you have been victimised by this company, in addition to filing a report here, with the BBB, the Consumer Protection Association and the BC safety authority, consider calling the Surrey RCMP Fraud Division.

You can view other Ropoff Reports about this company by searching the following report numbers: 360259 343023 369393 344748 The BBB has fixed their Web site so an on-line search now brings up the complaints. If you have been victimised by this company, in addition to filing a report here, with the BBB, the Consumer Protection Association and the BC safety authority, consider calling the Surrey RCMP Fraud Division.

You can view other Ropoff Reports about this company by searching the following report numbers: 360259 343023 369393 344748 The BBB has fixed their Web site so an on-line search now brings up the complaints. If you have been victimised by this company, in addition to filing a report here, with the BBB, the Consumer Protection Association and the BC safety authority, consider calling the Surrey RCMP Fraud Division.

You can view other Ropoff Reports about this company by searching the following report numbers: 360259 343023 369393 344748 The BBB has fixed their Web site so an on-line search now brings up the complaints. If you have been victimised by this company, in addition to filing a report here, with the BBB, the Consumer Protection Association and the BC safety authority, consider calling the Surrey RCMP Fraud Division.

Thank you for this report. I am going to need my furnace replaced and I am doing some research. I checked the Better Business Bureau Web site and I thought that if I didn't find a company in a search it meant it had no complaints. I decided to do a Google search on the companies I was considering and up popped this site. I have since requested a report from the BBB site and it is exactly as Michael reported above. This guy shrugs off 22 complaints as pretty good'. I checked a bunch of listings for his competition on the BBB site and most have zero complaints. This guy is a real black eye on the industry.

I find it interesting that Michael in his zeal to prove the disreputableness of my company and the accuracy of his almost obsessive campaign of slanderous innuendo, that he finds it necessary to trot out a Better business Bureau report. And that he thinks in some way this report helps validate his position. In my opinion Michael has truly shown how weak and hollow his argument as to this companies alleged wrong doings really is. These bevy of complaints as Michael alludes to, in no way support or even factually validate his position. Better yet why don't you put your money where your keyboard is and publish your last name. As to the BBB report There is an omission of critical facts that is central to the very core of the aforementioned report. Very simply the BBB report covers 22 complaints over 36 months (3 years) This company services approximately 5000 people per year and that equals 15,000 people serviced for what has been 22 complaints. That is a complaint ratio of 1 for every 681 people serviced and personally although I hate complaints I think thats pretty good.

Ive included the complete report from the Better Business Bureau here, less legalese. Just scroll down for the report. Setting the record straight; its true that my sister and mother were both there at the time of the sale. My sister is in her 60s but dont for a minute think that either one of them are particularly gullible, but they dont know much about furnaces. This just goes to show that anyone out there can become a victim, so check out the company you are planning to give money to. As for the carbon monoxide, the service tech said that it MIGHT be leaking carbon monoxide. My sister called me that day or the next to tell me this and that this is why they decided it was time for a new furnace. This is also why they wanted it installed as soon as possible, and were somewhat concerned about waiting for October 11. As far as the copy of the consumer protection act is concerned, I have been told that this is a very slick move by people who know what the usual result is. After someone has decided to purchase there is often a period of buyers remorse. So to counteract this, salesmen often use a strategy of giving the client information that would make the salesman or company seem to be looking out for the clients welfare. It is a legal requirement in BC to make consumers aware of the 10 day cancellation clause for all in-home sales. I dont know what to say about phone calls and knocking on doors. There is someone home almost always, so it would be very ill luck to try contacting twice with no results. People reading this report dont have to believe me, just have the company checked out. Contact the BBB for a report (a non BBB member doesnt show up in a simple search of the BBB Web site). Also contact the following agencies in BC and they might give you some additional information. Business practices and Consumer Protection Authority of BC Surrey Municipality The BC Safety Authority When reading the BBB report consider how many people a company has to irk in order to get one complaint. Ive heard stats that only 7-11%, of people with complaints, will actually complain. Most people will simply cut their losses, and never come back. BBB REPORT The BBB reports on businesses, both accredited and non-accredited. If an organization is a BBB Accredited business, it is stated in this report. Name: Pro Gas & Heating Phone :( 604) 597-4964 Fax :( 604) 597-8917 Address: 13708 63B Ave Surrey, BC V3X 3J7 Original Business Start Date: January 1993 TOB Classification: Heating Equipment & Systems Cleaning & Repair BBB Accreditation: This organization is not a BBB Accredited business. Additional DBA Names 0578047 BC Ltd 575158 BC Ltd Pro Gas and Heating 0578047 B C Ltd Customer Experience Based on BBB files, this company has an unsatisfactory record with the BBB due to failure to respond to two or more complaints. This company has chosen not to reply to complaints forwarded to them by the Better Business Bureau of Mainland B.C. When considering complaint information, please take into account the company's size and volume of transactions, and understand that the nature of complaints and a firm's responses to them are often more important than the number of complaints. The BBB processed a total of 22 complaints about this company in the last 36 months, our standard reporting period. Of the total of 22 complaints closed in 36 months, 8 were closed in the last year. Contract Issues No Response 1 - Company indicated it will not resolve consumer issues through the BBB process. Billing or Collection Issues No Response 1 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues. Unpursuable 1 - Company cannot be located. Sales Practice Issues No Response 1 - Company indicated it will not resolve consumer issues through the BBB process. Repair Issues Unpursuable 2 - Company cannot be located. Service Issues No Response 2 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues. 3 - Company indicated it will not resolve consumer issues through the BBB process. Customer Service Issues No Response 3 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues. Unpursuable 2 - Company cannot be located. Guarantee or Warranty Issues No Response 1 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues. Refund or Exchange Issues No Response 3 - Company indicated it will not resolve consumer issues through the BBB process. 2 - Company failed to respond to the BBB to resolve or address the complaint issues. Additional File Information As of January 22, 2008: The BBB reports that this company, Pro Gas & Heating, is NOT affiliated with Pro Gas Ltd. Additional DBAs, Addresses and Telephone Numbers Additional Addresses 100 6245 136 St Surrey, BC V3X 1H3 Canada Additional Phone Numbers Tel: (604) 597-3151 Tel: (604) 597-3086 Tel: (604) 597-3078 Tel: (604) 597-0378 Tel: (604) 501-1874 Tel: (800) 738-0199 Tel: (604) 523-3050 Report as of January 24, 2008 Copyright 2008 BBB, Inc. I believe that showing this report is fair use according to Canadian law. I hope Ripoff Report agrees.

I have been the proud owner of Progas and Heating for 16 years. I would like to thank this web site for the opportunity to set the record strait and it is my pleasure to respond to, what I can only describe as a complete pack of lies, false innuendo's and slanderous accusations leveled against this company and it's licensed gas contractor Manj Bains from the individual identifying himself only as "Michael". The customer in question Mrs. **** has been a client of this company since 2002 and has been serviced without incident. On August 25 2007 at 2pm we serviced the customer's furnace with out incident, the furnace was left in operational order. On September 25 2007 Mrs. **** called our office requesting service because her 25 year plus furnace had ceased functioning. Manj Bains (A licensed B Fitter) was dispatched at 12:02 to the customer's home to repair the problem (A pilot light that had gone out). The problem was fixed and the furnace was left functioning. Manjnoting the furnace was very old and being mindful of the fact that it had just broken down, and with no guarantee that the furnace, (because of its age) would not brake down again suggested to the customer and her Daughter (that was present in the home) that Mrs. **** replace her old furnace with a new, more reliable and energy efficient one. We absolutely did not state to Mrs. **** or her Daughter that her furnace had a melted heat exchanger or it could be leaking carbon monoxide as stated by the complainant Michael. Indeed had that been the case; why was the furnace left functioning after Manj (A licensed gas fitter) left there home? Why did Mrs. **** or the Daughter not react with horror to these alleged safety concerns by turning the furnace off? Or contacting another Service company, Gas Safety or make any attempt at all, to make the unit safe of which none of the above was done by the customer. The truth is these people continued to use there furnace because there was no safety concern raised by Manj Bains or Progas and Heating. These aforementioned statements from Michael (who was not present at the time) are nothing more than unfounded and inflammatory, baseless accusations. Upon determining that Mrs. **** and her Adult daughter were interested in the purchase of a new more reliable furnace Manj ask them to read and sign the Progas and Heating information and Discloser form of which provides a multitude of information . This company will not sell a furnace unless this form is read and signed. If the customer is over the age of 64, the company will not proceed with the furnace sale unless there is a younger family member or trusted other, present to validate the sale. In the case of Mrs. **** being 90 years of age her adult daughter confirmed there decision to purchase a new furnace then signed the form. It is truly interesting to note that Michael in his report about his 90 year old mother has not mentioned the fact that this lady's Daughter was present in the home and assisted and approved the furnace purchase. Indeed this 90 year old lady was not taken advantage of as Michael is trying to allude too. These people were also given a copy of the consumer protection act which among other things stated how to cancel of which was signed and received by the daughter. A contract was signed. A deposit was taken. The service call of $121.90 for 25 September 2007 (even though we did the repair) was voided (Company policy if purchasing a new furnace) The furnace was left heating the home until replaced, and a possible install date of Oct 11 2007 was noted but not guaranteed. Prior to October 11 2007 and with timely notification to Mrs. **** the install date was moved to November 17 2007. This was due to the needs of other customers that had Non functioning furnaces and Mrs. ****'s furnace was heating her home. On November 17 2007 at 9:01am the office called Mrs. ****'s home phone to notify her we were on our way. There was no answer. The install truck drove to the home and knocked on the door at 9:47am that same day, with no answer and a card was left. The following Monday at 10:10am contact was made with the customer and she was informed that because she had missed her install date, we would need to rebooked sometime in December. From December to present I have field phone calls from these relatives (Michael and Whitney). At no point have I been rude to Whitney. I have simply inquired and asked that Whitney read the signed and legally binding contract as to rebooking the install and the customers responsibility's as to providing us access to the home in order to complete the work agreed upon. It is clear these relatives have decided on behalf of Mrs. ****r to either go with another company or not to install a new furnace at all. Instead of acting honorably and negotiating in a professional manor the cancellation of the contract with this company, which would include paying us for shop time to date, Michael has chosen to try and invalidate the contract by besmirching this company's and Manj Bain's reputation by claiming what amounts to illegal misrepresentation of which is a nefarious and underhanded method to try and void a contract and it will not be left unchallenged. This company has signed documentation from the customer and her Daughter as described above as to doing things the reputable, forthright and correct way. I would very much love to see this claimants supporting documentation in support of his wild and slanderous accusations. My name is Eddie Lowe

The BC Safety Authority regulates registered gas contractors through Licensing. The BC public can report any contractor behaving in a non compliant manner to a Gas Safety Officer (gas inspector). Go to www.safetyauthority.ca for a list of local addresses and contact phone numbers of offices and Gas Safety officers for your area. Licensed Gas Contractors are required to comply with the B149.1-05 Natural Gas and Propane Installation Code, Gas Safety Regulation, the Safety Standards General Regulation, and the Safety Standards Act. Poor business practices can also be reported to the Business Practices and Consumer Protection Authority of BC. Go to www.bccpa.ca for more info on this.

Here are additional company names that have been used. 0578047 BC Ltd 575158 BC Ltd Pro Gas and Heating 0578047 B C Ltd