Complaint Review: Paypal.com - San Jose, CA

There seems to be two different things happening here. First is that the buyer filed an Item Not Received through Paypal, which you stated he withdrew. Therefore, it has been marked as resolved. The second is that he filed a dispute with his credit card company. That is open. Paypal asked you for the information, which you sent, and they are fighting the chargeback with his credit card company. "Resolved" means that it has been resolved through Paypal's "Resolution Team", not the chargeback. The chargeback is still ongoing. Which is why the funds are not available. Yes, you do need to send a copy of that e-mail to paypal, along with notification that you have not received the item back. They will forward that to his credit card company, who will go to him for a tracking number. If he cannot provide that information, then you will have automatically won. The reason that they did not forward a tracking number along is that when you sent it to him, he had not received the item. The complaint was valid. Even though the item was in transit, if they had sent it to his credit card company, he still hadn't received the item. They waited until the date that the item was received, then sent the information. That way, his company can call and ask if it had been received. If he said no, paypal sent the entire tracking information, including proof that he signed for the item, so he has been caught. His credit card company would not have closed the dispute while he hadn't received the item, even if it was in transit. Because, in the eyes of his credit card company, had the package arrived, and contained a different item, then the complaint is still valid because he hadn't received the item that he had paid for. They don't know if you're honest or not. From Paypal's website... "When a chargeback occurs, the money that is subject to the chargeback is deducted from PayPal's bank account. In turn, PayPal places a temporary hold on the same amount in the seller's PayPal balance (i.e., the funds are frozen). The seller and PayPal can work together to dispute the chargeback with the buyer's credit card company. While the chargeback is being disputed, PayPal will debit the seller for the amount in question. If PayPal and the seller ultimately win the chargeback dispute, the credit card company will reimburse PayPal for the chargeback and PayPal will transfer the recovered funds back to the seller. Depending on the credit card company involved, the process may take up to 75 days. In a dispute over a chargeback, the decision is ultimately made by the credit card company and PayPal cannot control the outcome." Again, the "resolved" that you see is through Paypal's Resolution Center. The chargeback fight is ongoing. You need to either e-mail or call Paypal, and ask them about where to send ALL the information you have, including all e-mail correspondance between you and the buyer. Providing no information will cause you to lose the chargeback. If, at the end of all this, you lose the chargeback.. It is in no way Paypal's fault. They didn't take the money from you. The buyer did. They aren't taking your money, they aren't cheating and they aren't stealing. The buyer is.

You stated, "Just because you provided a tracking number does not prove that the item was sent." Jason, The buyer filed a complaint of not receiving the item. There was no dispute that the goods or item was different then advertised or described. I had pictures of the item shipped. I also provided a detailed UPS receipt showing that the item was shipped to the correct address. As for the delivery confirmation number. You should know as any intelligent person would know that even the most basic operating system can pull up UPS's website and track the progress of a package in real time. You stated that, "the claim is an Item not Received, not an "Item not sent"." - Paypal doesn't give users an "Item not sent" option. The only option is the "Item not received" You also state, "If you send an item via UPS and the item is destroyed by UPS, the buyer isn't out the money, YOU are." Jason, The condition of the item is not and has never been the issue. Nevertheless, UPS automatically insures packages for $100.00. regardless of whether you add aditional insurance or not. You also stated that, "The best bet now is to contact the buyer via e-mail, verify that they did receive the item." - Jason, I have already done that but they have refused to cancel the complaint with their credit card company. But did state, "Yes I received it but sent it back to me and for me not to write them anymore." - According to UPS, they received it alright but didn't send it back. Should I send Paypal.com that email? Rather than Paypal.com leaving the matter in my account as being disputed, They changed it to having reached a settlement which is not the case.

My first guess on why Paypal didn't send the information to the credit card company is becuase although you did send them the tracking information, how were they to know that the tracking information was legitimate? You could have sent them tracking info for a box that contained a dog turd rather than a vintage robot. Just because you provided a tracking number does not prove that the item was sent. That's why paypal did not immediately forward the information to the credit card company. If they had, then the credit card company would have waited the extra time, or perhaps granted the claim because the item had not been received. Remember, the claim is an Item not Received, not an "Item not sent". If you send an item via UPS and the item is destroyed by UPS, the buyer isn't out the money, YOU are. Reason behind that is that who's to say you (by you I mean a generic seller) didn't bash the robot with a hammer before putting it in a box to be shipped by UPS? And since the buyer didn't purchase insurance from you... It's their fault. Wrong. The best bet now is to contact the buyer via e-mail, verify that they did receive the item, and if they are honest, they will reply that they did, you can take that e-mail and forward it to Paypal to forward to the credit card company to hopefully speed things up a bit. If they do not reply, or say they didn't get the item, then they're probably running a scam, and you need to get all your information together to fight it.

My first guess on why Paypal didn't send the information to the credit card company is becuase although you did send them the tracking information, how were they to know that the tracking information was legitimate? You could have sent them tracking info for a box that contained a dog turd rather than a vintage robot. Just because you provided a tracking number does not prove that the item was sent. That's why paypal did not immediately forward the information to the credit card company. If they had, then the credit card company would have waited the extra time, or perhaps granted the claim because the item had not been received. Remember, the claim is an Item not Received, not an "Item not sent". If you send an item via UPS and the item is destroyed by UPS, the buyer isn't out the money, YOU are. Reason behind that is that who's to say you (by you I mean a generic seller) didn't bash the robot with a hammer before putting it in a box to be shipped by UPS? And since the buyer didn't purchase insurance from you... It's their fault. Wrong. The best bet now is to contact the buyer via e-mail, verify that they did receive the item, and if they are honest, they will reply that they did, you can take that e-mail and forward it to Paypal to forward to the credit card company to hopefully speed things up a bit. If they do not reply, or say they didn't get the item, then they're probably running a scam, and you need to get all your information together to fight it.

My first guess on why Paypal didn't send the information to the credit card company is becuase although you did send them the tracking information, how were they to know that the tracking information was legitimate? You could have sent them tracking info for a box that contained a dog turd rather than a vintage robot. Just because you provided a tracking number does not prove that the item was sent. That's why paypal did not immediately forward the information to the credit card company. If they had, then the credit card company would have waited the extra time, or perhaps granted the claim because the item had not been received. Remember, the claim is an Item not Received, not an "Item not sent". If you send an item via UPS and the item is destroyed by UPS, the buyer isn't out the money, YOU are. Reason behind that is that who's to say you (by you I mean a generic seller) didn't bash the robot with a hammer before putting it in a box to be shipped by UPS? And since the buyer didn't purchase insurance from you... It's their fault. Wrong. The best bet now is to contact the buyer via e-mail, verify that they did receive the item, and if they are honest, they will reply that they did, you can take that e-mail and forward it to Paypal to forward to the credit card company to hopefully speed things up a bit. If they do not reply, or say they didn't get the item, then they're probably running a scam, and you need to get all your information together to fight it.

My first guess on why Paypal didn't send the information to the credit card company is becuase although you did send them the tracking information, how were they to know that the tracking information was legitimate? You could have sent them tracking info for a box that contained a dog turd rather than a vintage robot. Just because you provided a tracking number does not prove that the item was sent. That's why paypal did not immediately forward the information to the credit card company. If they had, then the credit card company would have waited the extra time, or perhaps granted the claim because the item had not been received. Remember, the claim is an Item not Received, not an "Item not sent". If you send an item via UPS and the item is destroyed by UPS, the buyer isn't out the money, YOU are. Reason behind that is that who's to say you (by you I mean a generic seller) didn't bash the robot with a hammer before putting it in a box to be shipped by UPS? And since the buyer didn't purchase insurance from you... It's their fault. Wrong. The best bet now is to contact the buyer via e-mail, verify that they did receive the item, and if they are honest, they will reply that they did, you can take that e-mail and forward it to Paypal to forward to the credit card company to hopefully speed things up a bit. If they do not reply, or say they didn't get the item, then they're probably running a scam, and you need to get all your information together to fight it.

The buyer first stated that he didn't receive the item, 3 days after payment was received. This is as you know, During the holiday when I was away on vacation. I contacted him and explained that I couldn't send it until the 13th. He said he understood and cancelled the complaint with paypal. As agreed, I sent the robot. and later that day, he filed another complaint saying that he hadn't received the item. Within minutes, I faxed all the required documentation to paypal.com and more than proved that the item was shipped to the correct address. 6 days passed. Paypal never submitted the information to the Credit Card company. They only done so when the buyer received the order and after I contacted them. Now I am without both; The Money, or, The Robot. If Paypal is going to dispute things for sellers, then they should do so in a timely manner and not wait days or weeks. Truth is, Paypal doesn't care about consumers. They take advantage of as many people as they can and will continue to do so until there are more law suits, news and press reports. If anyone searches the internet they will find tons of other people who have had similar problems with paypal. If there wasn't a problem, then there wouldn't be a class action law suit pending against paypal.com - Paypal.com has a long history of ripping people off. This is not old news but rather a long horrible history of facts regarding Paypal's modus operandi. Anyone thinking of using paypal should certainly consider looking at other online payment services. If you have paypal and haven't had any trouble then don't be surprised if you wake up one morning robbed!

Gotta be careful with buyers nowadays. Lots will do things like this to rip you off. Several things jump out at me. First, the buyer jumped the gun on filing an item not received report. 19 physical days, or 10 business days is a little quick. However, did you provide the tracking number to the buyer? Stay in contact with the buyer through the process? If the buyer was attempting to contact you, and there was no response, then the buyer did what they thought was best. In addition, shipping the item via UPS, the worst case delivery scenario is 6 business days. So there is a problem there. Assuming that you received payment immediately after the buyer won the auction, the item should have shipped on 9/2, which would put it in his hands on 9/13. It was not delivered until 9/19, which means the earliest that you shipped it was 9/12, barring UPS screwups. And I am taking into account the Labor Day holiday. There should have been communication from you to him informing him of this delay, no matter the reason. In addition, from your timeline, the buyer filed an Item not Received PRIOR to you sending the item. Why did you send the item after the Item Not Received was filed? Also by your timeline, the Item not Received was filed the day after Labor Day. The reason that Paypal took the money from you is that it was taken from them. The buyer filed a dispute with his credit card company, they reversed the charges, so Paypal either took the money from you or ate it. Guess which they did. Not to mention that this is clearly stated in the T&C that if there is a dispute, the money will be withheld from your account. The best I can tell from all this is that the buyer filed the dispute, and the dispute has not been finalized, but because of the dispute, the money is being held. When the dispute is cleared, which could take a month or more, I would guess that you will win the dispute and you will get the money.