Complaint Review: Shining Tree International Innovage Quantum FW1 Wax Sapphire Skies Promotions Olympus Marketing - Pickering Ontario

This is a fairly accurate report.  I interviewed with a subsidiary of this company and had the exact same experience.

Is it true that all sales are initially commission based? Yes.  Is it true that you have to work 12 hour days and drive to remote places to sell merchandise-as-charity? Yes. Is everything you do hyped up with its own song and dance number? Yes.

Let's put it this way: even if everything the company says about making money and earning a management position is true, it still has all the trappings of a business cult.  Long hours for what amounts to below minimum wage pay and guilt trips for people who don't make enough.  The morning hype and end of day 'meetings' are simply doublespeak. They serve no productive business purpose, only a psychological one: create an environment which reinforces the company mindset onto people who are already physically and mentally exhausted.

As for making manager in six to eight months... how many people even last that long?  Don't believe all the comments about 'not being able to hack it' and how this kind of work 'builds character'.  Their goal is to break you.  They WANT you to quit.  Their entire business model is built around the expectation of people quitting.  Let's say you only work there for one month.  You provide the energy, the time, the sales and the transportation.  The company pays at most a few dollars to cover your costs.  Then you get exasperated and quit.  Guess what?  The company just got a month of free labor out of you.  With even only half a dozen other people like you putting in their time at once, the manager now has 65-70% of the total profits... that's thousands of dollars a day.  If everyone stayed on and became managers there wouldn't be enough money to go around, guaranteed.  So the work is designed to degrade and indignify you until you give up.  They keep the money you made for them and never have to pay you a cent past commission.

Real sales and marketing is nothing like this.  Do yourself a favor and don't bother calling these people.  You can make more part time than with this nonsense.

I too worked for Quantum, not in the management training program, but in a different role. 

All of these people posting nasty, negative posts may feel they have been wronged, scammed or screwed by the company but suck it up!  Of course you can look back now and say what a bunch of assholes, but the fact is that for that time you were in the company you believed in everything they were saying and you were romanced by the idea of management and owning your own office.  That's YOUR fault you stayed if you were so unhappy!  How can you come on here and say what terrible people they are and what a terrible company they run when you too wanted exactly what they had?  You clearly looked up to your owner- their enthusiasm, their motivation and the money you believed they were making.  If you thought it was such a terrible place, you should have gotten out of there before hand rather than taking up their time and energy training you. 

My experience with Quantum was a god d**n life saver!  I made more money than I knew what to do with, made some long lasting friendships all over the country and now have an entry on my resume that I couldn't have made up if I tried!  Think about it- the experience you have gained SHOULD be worth it all! 

So I say suck it up, take the 5s and 8s with you because they are so important and impressive and go onto a new chapter, stop discouraging other people from joining this company just because you couldn't hack it!

That's my 2.

Btw- who died??  :(

Does your real name happen to be Dennis.....well anyway.....I just thought I would ask you, if this was an amazing company to sell stuff for...and you can make all this money, how come nobody who has retired rich, comes back to promote this amazing business, you never see a Murray Rinehardt, or any of the other "founders" or millionaires come back to one of your leadership conferences or owners weekend to say "You have to do this....look at me I am forty and retired a millionaire"........because nobody actually "retires" from this business, they quit, get blown out, or like one poor soul, died of cancer, and probably never got home before his children were in bed and asleep. NOBODY WHO HAS LEFT THIS BUSINESS COMES BACK TO PROMOTE IT AT SEMINARS OR ANYTHING....now if something really REALLY worked out for you, wouldn't you give back if you could....EXCEPT THEY CANT.....PUTNAM will never be able to retire.....Harmony Hunt....or anybody else...they will keep working, get enough suckers to promote their stuff and then they will SAY they dont "WORK", unless you call spending ninety hours a week TALKING about how good they were and how you aren't good enough.....haha....You are all mental slaves.....JUICE BY QUANTUM JUICE BY QUANTUM......

The FIRST FIVE YEARS.....sir, your owner has been workin 90 hours a week for 10 years and is no closer to retiring than my 16 year old brother...The "owners" you speak of that are your friends, are lying to you about how much money they make, guaranteed. Please, before you respond, just wait. I too was excited when I was the Asst. Mgr., I made great money...but just wait, every question you ask from ownership on, will get SPUN...to benefit them...then all these people you consider friends will slowly disappear, never call you again, and laugh at you for staying.
The People above you are VERY GOOD at manipulation, I was just like you at one time, and you dont stay open 3 years being bad as an owner....I left on my own terms, they didnt blow me out, once again....THEY DIDNT SHUT ME DOWN, I got tired of being strung along. The problem with this business is that everyday you have to find and sell new business everyday, it doesnt work man.

FYI, I now run a similar but very different business, where I have repeat customers, residual income!! I am still a business owner......which you will TECHNICALLY never be working for them! They TELL YOU what to do and you do it, or face the consequenses.

But hey man JUICE BY YOU for making it to management. Whoever you work for AFTER you quit, will have a great employee, or if you choose to use their information for your own personal gain, and find a great low overhead, high profit margin approach to a product or business, YOU WILL BE SUCCESSFUL, but only after you get yourself out of thier pocket.
The teachings are real, I am a firm believer in the fives and the eights, but I strongly encourage you to use the info you have been taught to line your own pockets not theirs.

Update me in 12 months.......

I would like to say - that in business - what people in the privacy of their home, how they get married - what car they drive all of that - stays in the privacy of that person. Who cares what he does, or what kind of house he has - just because he is not living by what your definition of right is.

2. I have 4 friends who are owners, have been in business for over 2 years now - they make money that you can only dream of. I go in the field, and I do my job and I bring home an honest - and good salary - I have a decent car.

Everyone that I encounter in this business I treat as aprofessional - I teach them everything that I know about that business - I make sure that I follow a strict guideline of ethics - I do not lie to anyone - I tell them how it is, if that is something that they like to hear then fine.

If you were an owner - then you are nothing more than a failure - obviously no one in this business is going to care about you because this is a business designed for those who success onl - not someone who is going to keep asking for "benefits" and "vacation time" - make your money and make your job your benefit. Make the freedom of being a business owner your vacation.

You need to have above and beyond drive - and you need to have a head on your shoulders. People please do not listen to all these sore looser who have failed at owning their own business. its not their fault 90% of businesses will fail within the first 5 years. Not everyone can do this - but I work to hard to just sit by and call me a scammer when I EARN every last penny - I don't sit around and wait for someone to hand my pay out to me.

Hey Mr. Asst. Mgr. just wait......I was a former owner.....the money you made in the field will be double whatyou make as an owner.....I will wait until you BLOW....then when you post how this company ruined your life.....you will wish you listened to all these people on here.....FYI..they care nothing about you....its all misdirection....your owner got married in a backyard of a house.....and I bet he tells you hes some type of National Consultant...haha....and that he doesnt drive a fancy car because he doesnt need one.....haha....and that house he has...ITS RENTED....(thats just a guess) but everything else is right on...if you have any questions just post them....I was an owner for too long and was strung along...I dont know what they call it now, but the crash flash....I was always in the top ten....and still....NO MONEY....had outside deals....STILL NO MONEY........its ALL FOR NOT BROTHER...I promise

I am a current assistant manager and soon to be owner of one of these companies. Everything that the original poster, and the comments on this report is false and miss-leading. I will break it down for all those interested in knowing the truth of how our company operates - I will do this by breaking down the original post and exmpain everything as I go:

1. You will receive NO Benefits - NO GAS money - why: You are an INDEPENDENT contractor - you come in the morning receive FREE training from us - after the training are are given the OPPORTUNITY to represent a client on OUR behalf. While representing the client you are ALLOWED to sell Items of the table that you have. Now you are an independent contractor that means you WORK FOR YOURSELF - this company just provides you the client and the supplies to sell - ohh and the FREE TRAINING ON HOW TO SELL IT ALL... you're welcome.

2. Team Day - this is where you get to learn how to work as a team, yes you SPLIT the commission thats only because the person you got paired up with CAN SELL and you CAN'T so the boss wants to make sure that you make some money so they sent you out to take the other persons money right? WRONG they are TRAINING YOU open your ears, stop talking and see what they are doing - they apply a very simple formula to everyone.

3. You should be able to sell $300/day minimum if you a)Talk to everyone b) apply the training formula you were given. This $300 can be achieved DAILY within 4-5 hours IF YOU FOLLOW THE TRAINING. - you will be paid 35% of that so roughly $100/day divided by 5 hours that's $20/hour to stand by a table at an event and call people over - once they come over simply telling them whats going on and offering a chance to buy something. EXTREMELY SIMPLE - IF you are in a location where there is no one coming to your event - well BE A BUSINESS OWNER AND FIGURE IT OUT! GO Door to door if you have to, this is your money - if you want it - then why are you waiting for someone to give it you.

4. The "BOSS" as you call it, is the same person that you are - they went thru the EXACT same thing - they stood by a table - they went door to door - they BATTLED IT OUT - and that is why they make SO MUCH MORE THAN YOU - because they understood the opportunity that this business is.

As you state 75% of people do not make it thru the week - that is not because the business as robbed them, or scammed them or conned them in any way - the ONLY reason someone quits the business is because they find that this type of high pressure commission sales is not for them.

This is not an easy job. Its not for everyone. Its HARD work with LONG hours - all worth it when you become an owner.

That is the whole point of the company - for you to become a business owner. You do not have to give up friends or your life I hardly think that starting at 8am and finishing at 6-7 to own your own business in a few months is a HUGE drain on your time.

As for the charities, yes the charities receive 5% of TOTAL COMPANY PROFITS = MILLIONS OF DOLLARS A YEAR - and now all of you think that we take all that other money and buy plasma TV's and ferraris right? WRONG - 90% of the money goes BACK into our business so that we can grow and as WE grow the charities can receive more and MORE money.

To all those reading this, a quick summary is this:
- this is a commission sales business (walk into a car dealership you will get the same thing only diff is you will receive a shitty $1500/month salary (and thats if you dont sell anything) and after about month 2 of you riding the salary you will be fired anyways.)
- you work for yourself so you have to manage your OWN time and your OWN money.
- this is an opportunity to own your own business - a legit business that offers a real opportunity - the only diff is the opportunity is harder to get but if you are strong enough you will reap the rewards.

Do not applly for this job if you want hourly pay, benefits or vacation. Your pay is COMMISSION your benefits are the fact that you will OWN YOUR OWN BUSINESS (all paid for btw) within a year (if you are good at the business)and your vacation is having the free time of owning your business when others are out in the field and you are just managing them now.

To all those who complain about this company - grow up = you are an adult you are responsible for your own happiness and well being - no one is going to GIVE you anything in this word and the sooner you realize that the better you will be.

Thank you for your time, everyone.

Happy Owner,

Ottawa, Ontario

you sir are pathetic - to call this company a scam or anything else for that matter. I am sorry that the world did not revolve around you when you were employed by them. I am sorry no one said - here is the gas money back for going out and making money.

This is a company that looks for winner - not losers like you - you are weak and pathetic - you are someone that just cannot figure out what kind of life they want for themselves - and instead of working hard for the things you want - you b***h and complain like every other loser on this planet.

I have been with the company for 3 months now 0 I am well on my way to becoming a manager and an owner - because I worked my a*s off - I LISTENED AT THE INTERVIEW AS EVERYTHING WAS EXPLAINED TO ME PROPERLY. YES you get [aid on commission NO you will NOT receive money for GAS YES you will work Saturdays - at the end of it all you get an office - ALL PAID FOR! you get a computer, a desk, a place to live - a TRUE winner works hard for all that he has.

continue working 40 hours a week till u retire and have nothing to show for yourself. I hate people like you so much - you have no idea what you are talking about - next time you are at a job interview you should really listen to what we are trying to do. off and as for the charities - they receive 5% of TOTAL PROFITS thats MILLIONS OF DOLLARS A YEAR!!!! and for WHAT for letting us use their LOGO!

when u start with us - an ENTIRE TEAM is there to help you and to teach you how to make sales - if you CANNOT MAKE THE SALES WHY DID U APPLY FOR A MARKETING JOB WHERE YOU HAVE TO TALK TO PEOPLE - MARKETING IS TALKING TO PEOPLE WHY WOULD U APPLY FOR A JOB WHERE U KNOW U HAVE TO TALK TO PEOPLE AND MAKE SALES TO MAKE MONEY!

seems to me that you are an idiot.

(((ROR redacted))) for any questions - to all those reading this - the original poster is nothing more than a quitter and a loser.

Thank you for your time.

Everything about quantum thats bad is true!......me and 2 others left the US to work directly under Keith Certo outside toronto, they paid for our hotel there for the week. we worked with Ian and Krissy Simpkins, Krissy got a fat a*s id like to stick it in but thats besides the point. Keith Certo lives in a dumpy a*s house outside toronto, ive been there, granted he did fill my gastank and spent 200 on dinner and booze at Hard Rock Cafe......needless to say, im not working there anymore, i quit..........dont work for these people, they use you and only the top make money, tenebaum, putnam and hunt......even the owners dont make money, the owner i was under drove a piece of s**t car and lived in a small apartment...lol.

I was with these companies for a year even made it Assistant Manager(So they told me). My Boss left the business (she got wise). Man, Keith Certo did her dirty. Anyway, I tried to stay in the business, hell i thought was good at it. Travel all over the United States from one office to the next. One office I went to in Texas the guy was smoking weed at the table. I told the owner what was going on. He told me that he already knew about it. Why didn't you fire him? So then I went NC Apple Unlimited. He was a good man(I thought). He was going to get me trained on DTV. I was happy. I Leave from NC to get trained in GA on DTV. Well one problem, the owner gave me the wrong number to get intouch with my trainer. And I got Blamed. How in the world of organized people, would I have known where to go? It gets better. I was told/ warned that I better not say anything or it wuld ruin my career. Just to take you back to an earlier time, When we as in me and my pregnant girlfriend (who use to be an owner) moved in to Dave Apples Apartment, He promised her an event Coordinator Position. Come to find out he was just trying to get in her pants. He never gave her that job infact, when he found out that she was pregnant he told her to get obortion. And told me while I was in GA that if I still wanted a Job I had to send her home. She had no where to go because you promised her a Job stupid. So I left.... The only good person I ran into in this business is Jock Ball, Man love you Really. Now when you talk about Shining Tree, you talk about Keith Certo. Keith promised me a Management Position, I got trained as a Victoria Jackson, Sams Club sales man on the road show.. If you really want to call it training.. They sent a girl out from boston to train us. She didn't train she yelled and cursed at us called us stupid and ran the members away. We got more complaints about this girl. they sent in someone else who actually taught us how to sell the crap. But Keith Certo told me if I left my pregnant girlfriend and came with him he would make me a manager. So if I sold my soul to the devil, I get my reward. These people are pathetic and i was on of them.... I said all of that to say this, the business is ran by partly by crooks and felons so what else do you expect from tose companies, I a not talking about quantum, innovage or smart circle. i am taling about those scamming companies that make up quantum.

I was with these companies for a year even made it Assistant Manager(So they told me). My Boss left the business (she got wise). Man, Keith Certo did her dirty. Anyway, I tried to stay in the business, hell i thought was good at it. Travel all over the United States from one office to the next. One office I went to in Texas the guy was smoking weed at the table. I told the owner what was going on. He told me that he already knew about it. Why didn't you fire him? So then I went NC Apple Unlimited. He was a good man(I thought). He was going to get me trained on DTV. I was happy. I Leave from NC to get trained in GA on DTV. Well one problem, the owner gave me the wrong number to get intouch with my trainer. And I got Blamed. How in the world of organized people, would I have known where to go? It gets better. I was told/ warned that I better not say anything or it wuld ruin my career. Just to take you back to an earlier time, When we as in me and my pregnant girlfriend (who use to be an owner) moved in to Dave Apples Apartment, He promised her an event Coordinator Position. Come to find out he was just trying to get in her pants. He never gave her that job infact, when he found out that she was pregnant he told her to get obortion. And told me while I was in GA that if I still wanted a Job I had to send her home. She had no where to go because you promised her a Job stupid. So I left.... The only good person I ran into in this business is Jock Ball, Man love you Really. Now when you talk about Shining Tree, you talk about Keith Certo. Keith promised me a Management Position, I got trained as a Victoria Jackson, Sams Club sales man on the road show.. If you really want to call it training.. They sent a girl out from boston to train us. She didn't train she yelled and cursed at us called us stupid and ran the members away. We got more complaints about this girl. they sent in someone else who actually taught us how to sell the crap. But Keith Certo told me if I left my pregnant girlfriend and came with him he would make me a manager. So if I sold my soul to the devil, I get my reward. These people are pathetic and i was on of them.... I said all of that to say this, the business is ran by partly by crooks and felons so what else do you expect from those companies, I a not talking about quantum, innovage or smart circle. i am taling about those scamming companies that make up quantum.

These companies usually contact you through CareerBuilder, Monster, or some other job search site. There should be a way to block them...guess we have to keep reporting them on the said sites.

Dear Anonymous Lake Wylie, South Carolina, I am sorry you are so easily influenced. I worked for the company for 8 months and got as close to management as possible without actually owning my own office. When you do become an owner good luck with the bills your stuck with. This is how it works. Mike Putnam and Scott will not let the company be truly "owned" by you. You have to ask for their permission before promoting out or anything else you want to do. However, when you get shut down, you are left with the bills and they will not agree to help you pay them. My owner got shut down and went 12 thou in debt for merchandise not sold and any other expenses. Mike and Scott wouldnt even lift a finger to help. Your paychecks might be big in your 2nd month because I am sure you are going to more events on your own and working the "better" events. Once you have a team your checks will be no more than 300 bucks. I was promoted to assistant manager and never saw a dime more. They tell you you get 100 bucks every day you spend in the office running it, but when it wasnt in my pay check I was told it was being put away for when I open. I quit before I opened, so where was my money. It is the worst company to work for, none of the owners drive nice cars, or own their own houses or go on trips or have families that do great things, and it is not because they are modest. It is because they make no money. If anyone can argue why this cmopany is good, I will surely retract my statement, goodluck!

Road trips to Dallas and Florida? How on earth can you even come into the states and sell DARE crap when the Olympus website says DARE Canada? Jesus, Quantum is like a cancer. It is spreading, and it will NEVER go away.

Okay, this is to all the people who have been to the interview at Olypmus Marketing, and all the other people who are reading these reports. I started with Olympus 2 Months ago. At first, I thought the same thing as everyone else here did. The office isn't flashy or nice, and it does seem sketchy. Now I've worked with the people there, and know alot about what goes on. First off, it is not a pyramid scheme, I don't know where people are getting that from, its a ridiculous accusation that is completely untrue. The company works with 2 charitable organizations that are not government funded, and non-profit organizations. We do not lie whatsoever about what we do to the people who help out, we do not claim to be a part of the charity, only representing the charity. Also 20% of our profits go back to the charities, not 5%. Obviously, this job isn't for everyone, you need to be an outgoing and bubbly person, be able to talk to people, and be able to brush off the rude or mean people with no problem. Yes, the entry level position is 100% commission, but this is a management training program, and you 100% will move into a management, salary based career in 6-8 months IF you are good at what you do. They do not lie to you about the entry level position, they do tell you that it is a commission based position, so I don't know why people on here are lying. Some people posted what kinds of paycheques they were getting, obviously they were not right for this job, my average paycheque is $400 + per week. The hours are long, so you must be a dedicated individual, if you want a real career, and your own office. We had a meeting where the Executive Director gave a speech to the personnel within our company, she was in tears over how much our company has helped the program, so if the charity is praising our work, how can we be a pyramid scheme, or a scam at all? All in all, I feel great doing what I do, I work hard, I have a career, I make good money, and I'm doing a great deed for charities in need of miracles. So for all you nay sayers out there, all I have to say is, have a heart.

Ok so here is a couple of corrections regarding my report. I am not going to go point by point but my report up top needs not necessarily corrections but clearing up and being more specific. I said you will not ever have gas refunded. I never personally saw or heard of anyone getting gas refunded not to say it couldn't ever happen. You can request to go out by yourself on saturday if you need to make extra money you don't HAVE to work in a team. It is possible to make more than 140$ in a day however it is extremely difficult i have seen people make over 200$ by themselves in a day before however if you do the math at 35% take home of what you sell it will be tough and tougher to do it consistently. It is definitely POSSIBLE to get to management in 6-8 months or whatever it is BUT it is EXTREMELY difficult, however it is possible, many many people do not make it through their first week for whatever reason. And the charities really don't get alot of what is made on a per day or per event basis, it is a small percentage but you have to figure they are relatively happy with what they get if that justifies it at all because they continue to do business with these people. Still................. get a real job...