Complaint Review: ITT Technical Institute - Liverpool New York

My teaching experience with this ITT-Tech school is UNBELIEVABLE! After experiencing the learning environment, I would NEVER HIRE AN ITT-TECH GRAD, no matter what their inflated GPA is.  Hold that thought; see last paragraph!

Yes, inflated! And yes, this SCHOOL is more of a Wall Street business than an institution of education. As told to me when I started, all that is needed for entrance to this school is a GED and promise to pay, or qualify for free grants.

Then the climate I experienced isn't even up to 5th grade level.  This school caters mostly to High School Drop Outs, and adults with little time on their hand trying to hold down their day jobs while hoping to get a valuable education to advance their careers. ITT-Tech is extremely fearful of the students again trying for an education program with them, and dropping out; thus not taking all the possible courses for one of their degree programs (aka - Mo’ Money).

Most likely non-transferable course credits to other real colleges as well.

http://www.itt-tech.edu/credits.pdf

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITT_Technical_Institute

"ITT Tech offers AAS, bachelor's BAS, and master's (business-only, online) degrees. ITT Tech is nationally accredited by the Accrediting Council for Independent Colleges and Schools.^[9] It may be impossible to transfer credits from ITT to a traditional university; per the ITT Web site, "it is unlikely that any credits earned at an ITT Technical Institute will be transferable to or accepted by any institution other than an ITT Technical Institute."

"ITT Technical Institute is a for-profit technical institute... ITT Tech is owned and operated by ITT Educational Services, Inc. (NYSE: ESI), a publicly traded company headquartered in Carmel, Indiana.^[6]...parent company ITT as an 83% shareholder.^[7]

ITT Tech licenses the "ITT" name from ITT Corporation, which originates from the latter company's original name "International Telephone & Telegraph".

Let’s dig a little further into what this accreditation of ITT-Tech actually means:

 “As an accreditor for many for-profit colleges, ACICS provided information during U.S. Congressional investigations of for-profit education in 2010. ACICS reported that the institutions it accredits are required to demonstrate a student retention rate of at least 75 percent. ^[3] Retention rates are calculated within a single academic year. ^[4]”

(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accrediting_Council_for_Independent_Colleges_and_Schools)

(http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/accredit)

Accredit: Seems to have several meanings, so which actually applies to the ACICS accreditation of ITT-Tech above?

 1. to ascribe or attribute to (usually followed by with ): He was accredited with having said it.

2. to attribute or ascribe; consider as belonging: an invention accredited to Edison.

3. to provide or send with credentials; designate officially: to accredit an envoy.

4. to certify (a school, college, or the like) as meeting all formal official requirements of academic excellence, curriculum, facilities, etc.

 Which stands out of the crowd for verifying what seems to cover: “a student retention rate of at least 75 percent”.  Assuring attendance rates, not so much the quality and acceptance of the education programs.

 5. to make authoritative, creditable, or reputable; sanction.

Without having dug into this definition further, you might have thought of #4 as this term which usually applies to traditional colleges/universities quality standard of education provided.

So buyer (potential students) beware - if you start with this school and want a degree, you probably will have to finish with them to get it, or waste your money starting over at another traditional college, because this accreditation isn’t recognized by other traditional schools. 

OLD SCHOOL people might call this ACICS accreditation a, “SMOKE AND MIRRORS TRICK”.  What you might be led to think, isn’t what you might be really getting.

Now to the actual education experience:

I made my students look up the answers to the end of chapter questions (15 - 30). Also, ITT-Tech uses those questions from the text book for Quiz and Final Exam questions. So wow- doing the home work makes perfect sense for getting good quiz/exam grades, eh!

Then I went over the homework to help them understand what they got wrong, before the corresponding quiz. Guess what! Students upset that I made them do that home work, and didn't give "OPEN BOOK" quizzes and exams instead! One said that I was the only instructor that made them do that work, and didn’t give “OPEN BOOK” exams; was very upset that her GPA was going to suffer because of my class.

Isn't that the kind of home work a Fifth Grader should be able to do?

Then they complained about how much time it took to do homework assignments. Keep in mind that I followed ITT-Tech's course syllabus', which states that they should expect to do 10 hours of "OUTSIDE CLASS WORK" per week as a minimum. I don't think the recruiters mentioned that requirement to them: albeit, other instructors practically just gave them passing grades, and why GPA is artificially inflated compared to “REAL” educational colleges/universities! They don't take quizzes to check their learning and comprehension of the courses materials; they do open book research projects for grades.

I can see them on the job now:

BOSS: “How about isolating that RF circuit?”

ITT-Tech Grad: “Let me look up what and RF circuit is first, then what “isolating” means!”

Then the absent policy is a farce! If a student misses two classes in a row, they must submit some kind of work to the instructor before missing another class to keep from being automatically dropped! Well, the amount and quality of that work doesn't really matter, as much as submitting something to keep the student enrolled and the cash register ringing!

You wouldn't believe how much effort goes into tracking down absent students and nagging them to come to class, or submit work so the attendance rate stays above 75% (keep that fantastic “ACCREDIDATION” label, and cash register keeps Cha-Chinging, and stock holders are happily sipping mint juleps on some tropical island!

At first break in the evening classes instructors are expected to be on the phone calling those students missing class. And students that are getting a "FREE" ride due to government grants, etc...whom don't really care about getting educated as much as getting money for going there know the "GAME" well; and that they will be given "OPEN BOOK" (so don't have to study and learn) Quizzes/Final Exams, and can turn in marginal work to get a passing grade (public assistance, or grant money keeps coming to their bank accounts).

Furthermore, many weekly assignments required 3-5 activities to complete the requirement for that week’s unit work; yet ITT-Tech has no system in place for the teachers to track and make accumulative grades for all those sub-parts of the assignments. So, it is very subjective what grades the students get. For instance, one student might do all the work and do it well to deserve an "A" grade. Another might only do 3 of 4 parts and still get a "B" for attempting to do it. Another might only do 50% of the assignment and get a "C", instead of failing! Another might do one part, not even do it well and be given a passing “D” grade.  How fair is that!

So, to get a passing grade from me, students had to do all the parts of the assignments, then I assessed how well they did them for their grade. I was highly encouraged to skew the grading standard to pass students that turned in ANY work, like my supervisor did!

Which leads to the old questions, "What do you call the last person that graduates Medical school in his/her class"?

Doctor!

What do you call the first and last students that Graduate from ITT-Tech?

This should be a contest - send in your replies!

Anyways, If you want a "QUALITY" and respected education, try another school that also isn't a "FOR PROFIT" institute (i.e.: Cash Cow for Wall Street stock holders of an old telephone and telegraph company) is my suggestion, and definitely check for transferability of credits to traditional schools.

If you have ITT-Tech on your Resume’, and sent it to my business – it goes immediately to the top of the circular file cabinet next to my desk, lined with a plastic bag, emptied daily!  Well, maybe not if it’s for a janitor job; mop and broom aren’t too technical to operate without an “open book” reference.

Hope I taught you somethng valuable in this lesson!

I just wanted to take a moment to offer support to you and your family during this very difficult situation.  In reading your story, I could feel your pain and frustrations.  While your unique situation isn't as cut and dry as some would like to make it seem, it should be used as a learning experience for you and your husband.  I'm not sure but it seems he had been unemployed or job hopping since being laid off in 2003.  Completing 18 of 24 months of anything and dropping out is not only irresponsible, but with a young child with these challenges, it's down right neglegent.  I'm assuming all of the info you have on the school is what you got from him.  A person pulling a 3.9 GPA is generally too dedicated to walk without a plan.  Is he a self proclaimed cripple? someone who gets close to success and throws in the towel to avoid having no more excuses for why life is difficult.  I'm asking because this is the person I was for 15 years...until my WIFE got fed up and stopped telling me what I wanted to hear.

As for the guy claiming you would've been provided a different lending institution had your credit been 'up to par'... that's false, as Sallie Mae is the "Banker" of choice for students who don't qualify for grants. 

Why didn't you READ the promissary note(s) before signing? How did you "accidentally" borrow 13K more than you "thought" you were going to borrow. I can imagine if he had finished school (only 6 months more for an AA), he would have a degree, with honors, and would be more qualified to get a better job. I know that there is no promise for a better life if he had graduated, but wow, you should understand that you guys made some really bad decisions here too. Lesson here - read before you sign..

I would first like to say that it is an unfortunate situation that you are in regarding ITT. I am kind of in the same boat with University of Phoenix online (also another school not to go to). My response is more of your daughter than the school. Have you ever heard of a DAN! doctor? DAN stands for DEFEAT AUTISM NOW. Now, i am not saying your child has autism, but my husband has ADHD and my youngest son has severe eczema and I took them both to the DAN! doctor. My husband started a regimine to get off of the prescription medications that therapists are putting him on and my son finally got tested to see what he was allergic to. I have taken my son to 4 doctors regarding his eczema. No one wanted to do a blood test to find out his allergies. His current doctor said, "well, he hasn't been to the hospital yet." So....what? In order for you to actually test my son he has to be bleeding from every orface on his body because he scratched himself and infected himself that bad? That's ridiculous. By changing my son's diet we don't have problems with his eczema. I found out that peanut butter (which was one of his favorite foods) was one of the leading causes of his itching (I did a little test at home). Because of the DAN! doctor my son is getting better. You should grab the book Mother Warriors by Jenny McCarthy and see if there is a DAN! in your area. You don't have to buy the book, the list is in the back of it by state.

"...We were lead to believe there would be all sorts of free government grants toward his education..." There are. You have to apply for them. Did you? "...He found himself in the class room in teacher assigned debates if prostitutution should be legal?!! Wow that sounds like he is learning computer and electronics technology alright!" It's called a General Education course, and students are required to take them in order to obtain a degree. "...well 6 months later we recieved our first repayment bill...$235.00. Well thats not the $100 we were promised to have to repay. So I called Sallie Mae and asked them for details, come to find out we borrowed $20,000 for his education!" I don't suppose you read the loan repayment disclosure before you signed it, did you? "...She recieves speech, occupational and physical therapy daily." While sad and unfortunate, this is irrelevant. Perhaps he should have gone to school for physical therapy instead. Did you ever consider that his leaving before the program was completed made all of the money you spent a complete waste? Perhaps, had he stuck it out, he'd be making enough money to pay back the loans (that's a smaaaall payment, by the way) and to take care of your children. But of course, it's much easier to point the finger of blame at someone else. Good luck with that.

your beef is with sallie mae..there are millions of dollars of free money out there...YOU have to find it...if your credit was up to par they would have given you another loan. Sallie Mae is the last and worst case scenerio loan..i graduated from ITT...had a job that paid 45 before i graduated and in nashville, the IT employers know and seek out ITT students..so I guess Im the only one that has a success story after ohhh, say 30+ years. he quit because he wanted 'family time'? thats the whole point of going to school..sacraficing now so you get what you want later...duh. 1.5 years will NOT teach you what you need to know about computers. He didnt learn anything because he wasnt interested.

They can turn $2-4,000 loans into $9,000 loans! Yikes for us! PRIVATE LOANS? We never knew we were taking out private loans! Wow! I never knew anyone could be so evil! We have a family of 5! and one private loan wants us to pay $500 a month toward their $9,000(originally about a $3,000 loan) bill! Well all we can do is pray, and ask for prayer requests.