Complaint Review: Americredit - Phoenix Arizona

Russ, Wouldn't you know it. A quice search on whitepages.com gave me some more info for the Internet. Stickel, Russ 19018 N 91 St Scottsdale, AZ 85255 480-538-2677 Have a nice day!

Russ, I know you told me that I better not reply to this anymore, especially if it was directed towards you, but I felt that the entire country should know about your immature ways. Also, if something does happen to me, LOL, how will you ever deny that it was you? I also wanted to make sure that your phone number was posted on the Internet so anyone could call you. :) Everyone who reads this, Today Russ decided he was going to call me. So, he read the report on Bill Heard Chevrolet that I submitted at, http://www.ripoffreport.com/view.asp?id=38266 and took the time to call directory assistance, and called me, not once, but twice. This is taken from both conversations which humored me to no end. The point of his calls is not known, but he seems a bit immature. He told me I was a fagot, told me I can't get any woman and have no life. Excuse me, but I'm not the one who took the time to call someone because they called me out on my lies! Russ also wanted to meet me. Once again, his true maturity shines through. He told me that I was intimidated by him, and that if I post another comment directed to him that I would wish he was Ernie. Well, sure sounds like a threat to me, so I reported it to Mesa and Scottsdale Police. The jokes on you Russ, that's a felony, and by using the phone that could make it Federal since the phones are regulated by the FCC. He commented on how ignorant I was and that I was less intelligent that a dog. Of course Russ doesn't know that I have a Bachelors of Science in Psychology with a minor in Sociology or that I am currently working towards my Masters in Business Management. Russ wanted to know where I worked, what I did, what I drove. Is he jealous, or is he going to stalk me? Hmmmm....well, I decided to take my own revenge. I won't call him, but I will post his name and phone number right here so anyone can call him, any day, any time. Russ So Russ, next time you want to shoot your mouth off I'd watch who you do it too, because I won't tolerate any s**t!

Russ,

I just did a quick loan amortization (is that word too big for you?), according to MS Office after two years of payments at 28.58% interest (which would give you a $850.14/mo pmt on $27K principal loan) you would only owe approximately $20,700, not the $27K you claim to still owe, that is how I know you are full of it.

I think you confused being negative with calling people out. You see, if you read the posts that I respond too, you will in fact see that the information that I provide is informational and helpful to the consumer, most of the time. The times that I reply being a complete d**k is because people, like you, are on here telling stories, or not telling the entire story, and that is not what this site is intended for.

As far as my intelligence and education go, well, I don't need to prove anything to you, but you can read some of the posts I have submitted on here and you will see that my educational level far surpasses that of yours. See Rip-Off Report http://www.ripoffreport.com/view.asp?id=38266 for the latest of my 'missions'.

I don't think I need to brag about what I make, and no, it's not as much as you make, about a third actually, but money doesn't make you smarter or less of an idiot!

As far as working at Taco Bell goes, maybe I like it there. I'm hoping that one day they'll let me work at the drive up window so that I can laugh at all of the people who come through the line that are more pathetic that I am. And my bike wasn't $50.00, I got a great deal at Salvation Army becuase us poor white trash can't afford much more than that.

And Russ, remember this next time you want to 'fight' with someone on the Internet: "Arguing on the Internet is like running a race in the Special Olympics, even if you win you're still retarded."

Hey Brandon lets start out with you. I have noticed that you respond to A lot of these articles and I know who you are. Ladies and Gentleman Brandon is A lonely sort of guy who has nothing better to do then to be negative on everbodys' stories. Look Brandon I make over 125 k per year unlike your salary at Taco Bell I can afford the interest I pay. I am not going to have A pissing contest on whether or not I have A Corvette or not Its in MY GARAGE!! Big deal Brandon its just A car get over it.. Who knows maybe one day when you move on too better things than Taco Bell you can actually afford A car instead of the $50.00 bike you ride back and forth to Taco Bell... Hey Brandon do us all A favor and hope on your bike and run for the border you loser.....

Russ,

You are full of $h*t. If you bought the car for $52K and put down $25K that means you would have financed about $27K...maybe even about $32K if the price of $52K doesn't include the fees already. So if you take the remaining balance that would give you a principal payment of between $450 and $533 per month. I can assure you that there is NOT $300 a month in interest.

You should probably get a life and a real job, that way maybe one day you can actually buy the Corvette you dream about and not the Daewoo that you currently own.

I have been with Americredit now for over 2 years. I love corvettes and I was actually renting A corvette at rent A vette on scottsdale rd. I was paying 200.00 A day and I had to go get A vette. I went to A place called midway Cheverolet on bell rd and put 25k down and still my payments are 850.00 A month the car went for 52k. What that means is I financed 27k on A 5 year plan. Well its been over 2 years and I still owe americredit 27k that means that I so far have paid 30 times 850.00 equals $25,500.00 in interest. You know why I pay so much interest is because my credit stinks. I signed the dotted line and I love my corvette. If I fall behind I make sure I call americredit and tell them I will pay by western union quick collect that day. They will call every day also that is there job. They have A call center of people that do nothing but call people everyday that are late on there payments. Hey, what can I say I love my vette and i signed the dotted line.. MERRY CHHRISTMAS AND HAVE A HAPPY NEW YEAR even you Jim.... See ya!!!

I have been with Americredit now for over 2 years. I love corvettes and I was actually renting A corvette at rent A vette on scottsdale rd. I was paying 200.00 A day and I had to go get A vette. I went to A place called midway Cheverolet on bell rd and put 25k down and still my payments are 850.00 A month the car went for 52k. What that means is I financed 27k on A 5 year plan. Well its been over 2 years and I still owe americredit 27k that means that I so far have paid 30 times 850.00 equals $25,500.00 in interest. You know why I pay so much interest is because my credit stinks. I signed the dotted line and I love my corvette. If I fall behind I make sure I call americredit and tell them I will pay by western union quick collect that day. They will call every day also that is there job. They have A call center of people that do nothing but call people everyday that are late on there payments. Hey, what can I say I love my vette and i signed the dotted line.. MERRY CHHRISTMAS AND HAVE A HAPPY NEW YEAR even you Jim.... See ya!!!

I have been with Americredit now for over 2 years. I love corvettes and I was actually renting A corvette at rent A vette on scottsdale rd. I was paying 200.00 A day and I had to go get A vette. I went to A place called midway Cheverolet on bell rd and put 25k down and still my payments are 850.00 A month the car went for 52k. What that means is I financed 27k on A 5 year plan. Well its been over 2 years and I still owe americredit 27k that means that I so far have paid 30 times 850.00 equals $25,500.00 in interest. You know why I pay so much interest is because my credit stinks. I signed the dotted line and I love my corvette. If I fall behind I make sure I call americredit and tell them I will pay by western union quick collect that day. They will call every day also that is there job. They have A call center of people that do nothing but call people everyday that are late on there payments. Hey, what can I say I love my vette and i signed the dotted line.. MERRY CHHRISTMAS AND HAVE A HAPPY NEW YEAR even you Jim.... See ya!!!

I have been with Americredit now for over 2 years. I love corvettes and I was actually renting A corvette at rent A vette on scottsdale rd. I was paying 200.00 A day and I had to go get A vette. I went to A place called midway Cheverolet on bell rd and put 25k down and still my payments are 850.00 A month the car went for 52k. What that means is I financed 27k on A 5 year plan. Well its been over 2 years and I still owe americredit 27k that means that I so far have paid 30 times 850.00 equals $25,500.00 in interest. You know why I pay so much interest is because my credit stinks. I signed the dotted line and I love my corvette. If I fall behind I make sure I call americredit and tell them I will pay by western union quick collect that day. They will call every day also that is there job. They have A call center of people that do nothing but call people everyday that are late on there payments. Hey, what can I say I love my vette and i signed the dotted line.. MERRY CHHRISTMAS AND HAVE A HAPPY NEW YEAR even you Jim.... See ya!!!

Jim:

> So you admit that you will not tell me the truth when you walk thru my door.

No, that's not what I said at all & I suppose I wasn't as clear as I could have been. I won't lie to anyone - for instance, when I bought my new car last month, & the first question out of the salesman's mouth was, "Do you have a trade?" I said, "I don't know - I have someone who might be interested in buying it, but if not I will be trading it in. Let's just discuss the price of the car."

That's NOT a lie, and it wouldn't be for anyone else, either. Very often, when friends, family, etc. find out you're buying a new car, SOMEONE you know will be interested in buying your old one.

It's not about lying - it's about not giving away unnecessary information too soon. You - as a salesperson - are trained to get this info so we - the buyers - lose ground in the negotiations. So don't get testy when we decide not to. There's no reason you should negotiate a different price for someone trading in a car than you would for someone not trading in a car. The price of the car is the price of the car; the price of the trade-in is the price of the trade-in. Most people don't understand that if you give away the trade-in too soon - let the dealer appraise it, etc. - it affects the price you're willing to negotiate on the car.

> I really don't know how we got on the trade subject but let me use it as an example....Your trade whatever it is is worth what the whole sale market is...if you really want to know how much your trade is worth go to the Greater Az auto auction and see for yourself what a vehicle like yours is bringing. It really is that simple. Or go to several independent dealers and ask them to purchase your vehicle outright....once again a way to find the true value.

We got on the trade subject because you brought it up as a complaint about how customers "lie" - by not telling you about a trade until the price has been negotiated. (How is that a problem? The price of the car is the price of the car, right?)

I did check out the wholesale value of my trade-in. The salesman then tried to convince me that my car was in terrible condition (even though it had no body damage, rust, etc.; spotless interior; perfectly maintained engine with all service records available; etc.) & it was going to be "a stretch" for him to get me $500 LESS than what I had been told the wholesale value of my trade-in was. I know that's part of the game & I was prepared for it - and in the end, my sister decided she DID, in fact, want to buy the car so it ended up being a moot point.

Point being - you guys are going to try to get as much from the buyer as you can while giving up as little as you can. That's business. But it is sometimes done unethically where car sales are concerned. No one is saying ALL car dealers & salesmen are out to screw the customer, but clearly some of them are. And your attitude in your original response - about how you (salesmen) all know that "all" customers lie about everything - seemed to be trying to justify unethical behaviour on the part of the salesmen who do use shady tactics.

> If you wish to purachse a vehicle from the auction then get your self a whosalers license and do so. Just don't expect a RETAIL business to sell it to you without a profit.

Thanks for the tip, but I already have a car.

And, as I've noted above (& I believe I noted it in my original comment; if not, I meant to but got sidetracked) - no one is saying you don't have the right to a profit. But you don't have to screw the customer to get it. An educated customer is less likely to get screwed, and that's the service ED, the EDitor tries to provide here - educating the customer.

So you admit that you will not tell me the truth when you walk thru my door.

I really don't know how we got on the trade subject but let me use it as an example....Your trade whatever it is is worth what the whole sale market is...if you really want to know how much your trade is worth go to the Greater Az auto auction and see for yourself what a vehicle like yours is bringing. It really is that simple. Or go to several independent dealers and ask them to purchase your vehicle outright....once again a way to find the true value.

If you wish to purachse a vehicle from the auction then get your self a whosalers license and do so. Just don't expect a RETAIL business to sell it to you without a profit.

Never walk onto a lot alone. You are screwed from the beginning should you do so. Lot Shark trick number one is appealing to emotion rather than reason. Just look at all the suckers driving Lexus SUVs. You need someone to bust the illusions good salesmen are good at spinning. Bring your spouse, Dad, or meanest friend you have. If you're single, an orphan, or friendless then keep on using public transportation if you don't want fleeced.

If there are two people involved in a decision and the salesperson finds it difficult to appeal to emotion, he/she will identify/isolate the decision maker. When I bought my last car they (Bill Pierre Ford - Lake City, WA) went so far as to leave my wife and me "alone" in a conference room to discuss matters while listening in using the conference function on the telephone on the table. Check the telephone and unplug it if you must, or better yet, talk about it outside.

Practice the Good Cop/Bad Cop thing with your buying partner. They'll kiss the bad cop's a*s something fierce and might make some key concessions. After the salesperson figures out which cop is "good" and which "bad" and thinks everyone is buttered up, switch roles. This will drive them nuts and you'll be wearing the salesmen down instead of vice versa.

If you have a trade-in, be honest about it and let the dealer know it exists. NEVER park it on their lot. NEVER give anyone the keys.

Don't bother with used cars. If your credit is good enough for a used car then it's good enough for a new car. The profit margins on used cars are huge and even huger on the warranties the dealer will stick you with.

Above all, be strong and patient. If you only want to give X dollars as a down payment, let the salesmen know that X dollars is firm and if they try to get one cent more out of you you'll walk right off the lot. Ditto for any monthly payments. Make good on your threats/promises. If you do have to walk off the lot, make a scene about it (this is one reason you shouldn't leave your trade or keys in the dealers hands).

If you do all of the above the salesmen will eventually throw up his/her hands and give up, hoping that instead of being a mark he can convert you into someone who comes in every other year to buy a new car. It's better than nothing.

Never walk onto a lot alone. You are screwed from the beginning should you do so. Lot Shark trick number one is appealing to emotion rather than reason. Just look at all the suckers driving Lexus SUVs. You need someone to bust the illusions good salesmen are good at spinning. Bring your spouse, Dad, or meanest friend you have. If you're single, an orphan, or friendless then keep on using public transportation if you don't want fleeced.

If there are two people involved in a decision and the salesperson finds it difficult to appeal to emotion, he/she will identify/isolate the decision maker. When I bought my last car they (Bill Pierre Ford - Lake City, WA) went so far as to leave my wife and me "alone" in a conference room to discuss matters while listening in using the conference function on the telephone on the table. Check the telephone and unplug it if you must, or better yet, talk about it outside.

Practice the Good Cop/Bad Cop thing with your buying partner. They'll kiss the bad cop's a*s something fierce and might make some key concessions. After the salesperson figures out which cop is "good" and which "bad" and thinks everyone is buttered up, switch roles. This will drive them nuts and you'll be wearing the salesmen down instead of vice versa.

If you have a trade-in, be honest about it and let the dealer know it exists. NEVER park it on their lot. NEVER give anyone the keys.

Don't bother with used cars. If your credit is good enough for a used car then it's good enough for a new car. The profit margins on used cars are huge and even huger on the warranties the dealer will stick you with.

Above all, be strong and patient. If you only want to give X dollars as a down payment, let the salesmen know that X dollars is firm and if they try to get one cent more out of you you'll walk right off the lot. Ditto for any monthly payments. Make good on your threats/promises. If you do have to walk off the lot, make a scene about it (this is one reason you shouldn't leave your trade or keys in the dealers hands).

If you do all of the above the salesmen will eventually throw up his/her hands and give up, hoping that instead of being a mark he can convert you into someone who comes in every other year to buy a new car. It's better than nothing.

Never walk onto a lot alone. You are screwed from the beginning should you do so. Lot Shark trick number one is appealing to emotion rather than reason. Just look at all the suckers driving Lexus SUVs. You need someone to bust the illusions good salesmen are good at spinning. Bring your spouse, Dad, or meanest friend you have. If you're single, an orphan, or friendless then keep on using public transportation if you don't want fleeced.

If there are two people involved in a decision and the salesperson finds it difficult to appeal to emotion, he/she will identify/isolate the decision maker. When I bought my last car they (Bill Pierre Ford - Lake City, WA) went so far as to leave my wife and me "alone" in a conference room to discuss matters while listening in using the conference function on the telephone on the table. Check the telephone and unplug it if you must, or better yet, talk about it outside.

Practice the Good Cop/Bad Cop thing with your buying partner. They'll kiss the bad cop's a*s something fierce and might make some key concessions. After the salesperson figures out which cop is "good" and which "bad" and thinks everyone is buttered up, switch roles. This will drive them nuts and you'll be wearing the salesmen down instead of vice versa.

If you have a trade-in, be honest about it and let the dealer know it exists. NEVER park it on their lot. NEVER give anyone the keys.

Don't bother with used cars. If your credit is good enough for a used car then it's good enough for a new car. The profit margins on used cars are huge and even huger on the warranties the dealer will stick you with.

Above all, be strong and patient. If you only want to give X dollars as a down payment, let the salesmen know that X dollars is firm and if they try to get one cent more out of you you'll walk right off the lot. Ditto for any monthly payments. Make good on your threats/promises. If you do have to walk off the lot, make a scene about it (this is one reason you shouldn't leave your trade or keys in the dealers hands).

If you do all of the above the salesmen will eventually throw up his/her hands and give up, hoping that instead of being a mark he can convert you into someone who comes in every other year to buy a new car. It's better than nothing.

Never walk onto a lot alone. You are screwed from the beginning should you do so. Lot Shark trick number one is appealing to emotion rather than reason. Just look at all the suckers driving Lexus SUVs. You need someone to bust the illusions good salesmen are good at spinning. Bring your spouse, Dad, or meanest friend you have. If you're single, an orphan, or friendless then keep on using public transportation if you don't want fleeced.

If there are two people involved in a decision and the salesperson finds it difficult to appeal to emotion, he/she will identify/isolate the decision maker. When I bought my last car they (Bill Pierre Ford - Lake City, WA) went so far as to leave my wife and me "alone" in a conference room to discuss matters while listening in using the conference function on the telephone on the table. Check the telephone and unplug it if you must, or better yet, talk about it outside.

Practice the Good Cop/Bad Cop thing with your buying partner. They'll kiss the bad cop's a*s something fierce and might make some key concessions. After the salesperson figures out which cop is "good" and which "bad" and thinks everyone is buttered up, switch roles. This will drive them nuts and you'll be wearing the salesmen down instead of vice versa.

If you have a trade-in, be honest about it and let the dealer know it exists. NEVER park it on their lot. NEVER give anyone the keys.

Don't bother with used cars. If your credit is good enough for a used car then it's good enough for a new car. The profit margins on used cars are huge and even huger on the warranties the dealer will stick you with.

Above all, be strong and patient. If you only want to give X dollars as a down payment, let the salesmen know that X dollars is firm and if they try to get one cent more out of you you'll walk right off the lot. Ditto for any monthly payments. Make good on your threats/promises. If you do have to walk off the lot, make a scene about it (this is one reason you shouldn't leave your trade or keys in the dealers hands).

If you do all of the above the salesmen will eventually throw up his/her hands and give up, hoping that instead of being a mark he can convert you into someone who comes in every other year to buy a new car. It's better than nothing.

Customers always lie, eh?

You say: When asked if you have a trade, the answer is always no until final negotiations are made.

Of course it is. This is because if a buyer tells you he has a trade, you want to see & appraise it - and you work that amount into your "negotiation." So if I have a trade-in worth $3,000 - which you'll tell me is not really worth $3,000 but you'll try to stretch it & get me $2,000 - you'll make d**n sure you make me pay for that $2,000 somewhere. That's basically the same as taking the buyer's trade-in for nothing & making him pay whatever you want.

More truthful for the buyer is to say "I don't know - I have a friend who might buy it, but if he doesn't I'll be trading it in." And then REFUSE to give any information on your trade-in (make, model, year, condition) & DO NOT let the appraiser near it until the negotiations are done. Why is this more truthful? Because every time I've gone to trade in an old car when buying a new one, someone I knew ended up being interested in my old car once they found out I was getting a new one, so I've never done a trade in.

You say: When asked if they have good credit the answer is always yes until we run it.

Since lenders are, as ED mentioned, hell-bent on NOT letting borrowers know what their credit scores are, we have to rely on our credit reports - when that's only part of the equation. There are a lot of people who think they have fine credit scores, but because of one credit card payment that arrived 2 days past the due date 4 years ago, their credit isn't SPOTLESS, so they get screwed into paying the same rates as someone who hasn't made a timely payment since the Nixon administration.

And don't try to pin it on people with lousy credit. I have - and always have had - PERFECT credit, but when I bought my first new car at age 24 I was charged an insane interest rate. Why? Because - and I'm quoting here - I'd never financed a car before. Never mind a 4-year perfect payment history with two major credit cards, 3 store charge cards, rent, utilities, etc. They were out to get as much money from me as they could, however they could.

You say: When asked what payment they want, people say blah blah blah...

Why on earth would I tell you what kind of payment I want? That kills any negotiating power I have right there - you then know the most I'm willing to pay & won't settle for a dime less!

Besides, that's a dumb way to decide on the price of a car. It's not about the monthly payment - although that enters into it for many people - it's about getting a fair deal for all parties. Of course you are entitled to make money on the deal, but too many salesmen - and you seem like one of them - are out to fleece the customer. That's bad business.


Yes, Loretta signed on the dotted line. Yes, she agreed to make payment of a certain amount by a certain date each month. And yes, she admits she fell a month behind. And you may just be enough of a d**k to think that means she deserves to have her car repossessed with no notice. I think sometimes things happen & people fall behind on their bills; one month's late payment shouldn't mean you lose your car. And while she probably should have contacted Americredit to work out some sort of payment plan - not because it would have been honoured, but because that way she could cover her butt when it wasn't - if Americredit could take the time to contact the repo man, someone certainly should have let her know he was coming.

I hope consumers keep in mind that not ALL car salesmen are like this jackass. I recently bought a new car from a guy who worked with me to get a price I was comfortable with, who didn't pressure me into signing anything, and who allowed me to seek my own financing (I did finance through the dealer, but only because they were able to get me a slightly better rate than my bank offered me - if you can believe that!).

My advice to anyone buying a car is this: Talk to the salesman before you commit to anything. Don't sign anything unless you are completely comfortable with the deal and you are certain you understand the terms. And if you get any of the high-pressure BS - or any of the other shady tactics ED mentioned in his response - run, don't walk, back to your car & drive to another dealership. Repeat until you find someone you ARE comfortable with.

It is true that the job of the salesman is to sell you the car for as much as you are willing to pay - but there are ones out there who will do it ethically.

Now it is my turn at you...

You say, "If a car buyer's lips are moving that they are lying." Well, most car buyers do not want you to know how much of a payment they can handle, and rightfully so. It understandably puts them at a significant disadvantage in negotiations. No matter how much they tell the dealer's sales that they are OK with the dealer's sales staff will always try to grind for more. If they are weak at getting the buyer to agree to more they will bring in a second face. Maybe the Sales Manager (SM) will push the "GREEN PEA" out of the way and bring in the veteran "LOT SHARK" who has more "teeth."

Since you have brought up the fact that you have been in auto sales for 12 years, you know that it is your job to grind for all of the JUICE that you can squeeze out of every "UP" that comes on your lot.

I say it is high time we expose all of the deceptions that car dealers do not want the public to know about. In the past car dealers have never had to worry about their local media, newspapers, local TV stations and talk radio expose the dealer's dirty tricks. I know, Mr. No-name, that the web site just bends you out of shape because you can't shut it down nor can you censor it.

Let's talk about car dealers doing the following:

1. Car dealers charging a car buyer a hidden fee that they all call "PACK." Oh, you have to hide it, but you make the "sucker" pay it.

2. Let's talk about car dealers lying abut the "BUY RATE" to the car buyer. You get they to agree to 12% on the buyers contract and after the poor soul leaves your "shark pond" your F&I shark will get the loan bought for maybe 8% or 9%. Why can't you tell the car buyers about that little cash flow?

3. Lets talk about "Lot Sharks" telling the car buyers, "Oh, there are no rebates on the one you like..." So, the Car buyer buys a different car and goes home. Then your F&I shark (or your SM) will make sure that the dealer gets the rebate money that the buyer thinks does not exist.

4. Let's talk about car dealer's fake, over-priced paint protection that some car dealers like to call "an appearance package" for as much as $1600 bucks. In actuality it is just a temporary silicon rub.

5. Let's talk about car dealers having deceptive ADM stickers, made to look like the car MAKER put then on at the factory. You know, a deceptive way to make the buyer pay more then sticker for something that is worth so much less.

6. Let's talk about SM's and GM's stealing the front-end gross... It sure makes it much easier if you hire "GREEN PEAS" You agree ?

7. Let's talk about car dealers doing what is called a "SPOT DELIVERY" and why they love to do that. (I have so much more to talk about this, but I will give you the opportunity to do something novel... be honest and tell us all about this.)

8. Let's talk about car dealers having or training their sales staff how to pad the Buyer's income on the credit application. You know, lie to the bank and make it all look real pretty, so the payer will hang real fast, you take the car back and they are still on the hook for the full amount of the loan, while you sell their ride, (auction) the car to a buddy or relative for pennies on the dollar.

9. Let's talk about car dealers creating misleading and deceptive advertisements in their newspaper ads and radio spots. (The latter is better because it is harder for the pidgeon to produce the proof.) In fact, you need a magnifying glass to read the d**n disclaimers.

10. Let's you and I talk about double dipping in the shop on warranty repairs. You know, tell the car owner that the repair needed is not covered under the warranty and then make the car owner pay for the repair . Later, you get the maker to pick up the repair on the warranty and you get to keep what the owner paid.

11. Let's talk about car dealers keeping the car buyer from seeing their credit report. Oh, GOD we can't have a car buyer EVER see their Fair Isaac score. Can't have an educated consumer. Explain to us why the BIG secret.

12. Let's talk about car dealers photo copying the car buyer's drivers license for the "TEST DRIVE." While the "TRAINED LOT SHARK" has his soon-to-be VICTIM out for the test drive, the desk manager is pulling a credit report on the would be car buyer without his/her knowledge or permission. I dare you to deny it.

13. Let's talk about car dealers never telling the buyers about the cooling off period. Most all car dealers will never tell car buyers that in most states that there is no cooling off period. Can't tell the buyer ANYTHING that will make them want to go home and sleep on the deal before signing any documents that the F&I guys cram down the buyer's throat.

The auto industry has to come to the acknowlagement that their crooked money-making tricks and secrets are coming out for one and all to see thanks to the RIP OFF REPORT.

Good day, ripoff artist

ED Magedson
[email protected]

Oh wait you did say that you were one month late? Didn't you?

Well guess what then...YOU SIGNED! a contract that said you would make the payments on time but you failed to do so.

Ladies and Gentlemen readers of this amusing web site I submit to you this case along with the case of ENRON that this is the the trouble with this country.......too many victums, too many cheats and liars that permiate thru our society.

We have a saying in the car business "a buyer is a liar" every time they speak. We ask do you have a trade and the answer is no untill the final negoaitions are done. We ask do you have good credit the answer is usually yes untill we run it (most folks with bad credit will admit it so we work harder to help them than the ones who lie about it). we ask do you have a down payment the answer is usually no untill we push them a little. What payment do you feel comfortable with?( the answer is always between $150 to $250 enogh to buy a $5000 to $8000 car but they are looking at a $20,000 one. they always leave the Business office with more payment due to warranties and theft protection.

So do not speak of deceptive pratices unless you have walked in my shoes for twelve years. And let me add that without sales people that nothing would happen...it all STARTS with the sale.